How to overcome difficult times and still build a sustainable business

Akua: Building successful business is never easy. There are going to be seasons where you are crushing it, but there will be seasons where life just happens. So how do we continue to do our best, show up and choose joy throughout the whole process? Well, it’s definitely not easy. And today’s guest, Angie McPherson, shares with us exactly what that has looked like for her.

Angie is a brand photographer, marketing strategist, and educator, and she walks us through her entrepreneurial journey and shares with us how she was able to stay grounded as she walked through the hardest seasons of her life and still build a sustainable business. Angie reminds us that choosing yourself and finding joy can help you through the wild seasons of entrepreneurship.

And keep you focused on building the business and life of your dreams. Now let’s get into the episode. Hey everyone. This is your host Akua Kanadu, and you’re listening to the Independent Business Podcast. More people than ever are working for themselves and building profitable businesses in the process.

So on this show, I get to sit down with some of the most influential authors, entrepreneurs, and creators to break down the science of self made success so that you can achieve it too.

It’s a vibe. Hey girl. Hello. Hello, 

Angie: dear. Oh my gosh. How are you? I’m doing so great. So, so happy to be here sitting in so much gratitude for you having me on. Like I adore you. I adore the podcast. Like what is life right now that I’m here? Oh my gosh. 

Akua: Well, no, I adore you. And of course I knew you were going to come on the show girl.

I was just going to be, you know, just a matter of time. It’s like divine, divine timing that the time has finally arrived and I’m just. I’m just really excited to have this conversation with you because when I first met you back in 2021 at the Creative Educator Conference, we were both speakers that year, and, I just loved you.

Like, number one, I was obsessed because I just loved so much about your personality, of like, how you love game shows. Like, you are one, just, the most lucky, like, one of the lucky people, like, with game shows and stuff that I just 

Angie: see all the time. I’m like, go ahead, girl. I love a good game show. Like, if something’s like, oh, we are accepting applications, I’m dropping everything and I’m applying for this daggone game show.

But you’ve 

Akua: been on some game shows. 

Angie: I’ve been on I’ve been on two. Yeah. And I’ve applied for some, some really big ones this year. And I’m just like, I’m going to catch my big break. I just know it. Like, I would love to get on, have you ever watched squid game challenge on Netflix where it’s like 400 people and like one person wins like four point something bajillion dollars.

Like I’m getting on that show. I’m getting on that show or I’m getting on the circle. One of those, I’m claiming it. I’m claiming it. We’re 

Akua: claiming it. And when you get on the circle, girl, or I will be watching, like, it’s not even an if, it’s when. We are literally, it’s happening. We are speaking this into fruition.

When it happens, girl, I will be rooting for you. I will be so thirsty watching every single week, tagging you in every single video because it is going to happen. But one thing that I just love so much about you is that you truly are an individual who just. Radiates joy and you see it all throughout your brand, your work, everything that you do when people are around you.

I just, I feel so excited, so uplifted, so seen and valued. And I truly like that is truly a gift. Like a lot of people don’t have that and you are one of the people that have that. And so, but one thing that I just want to talk about just with you, of just how you’ve evolved as a business owner, I feel like there’s just been, you have had, you know, like all of us, like.

High highs and low lows. And so for you, walk us through like what your journey of entrepreneurship has looked like for you to where you are today. 

Angie: Yeah. It’s so interesting to think about my journey. I’ve been a photographer and an entrepreneur for 11 years now. And I don’t know, it’s like the longer you’ve been an entrepreneur, it feels like you Just started a business and it feels like you’ve been business forever.

Like it’s like these two very different feelings. Like sometimes I can’t believe that I like my very first photo shoot, I did like a senior session for 50 and like, she literally handed me, like I drove to her house, printed out the contract. She signed the contract. I drove it home. Like it’s crazy. And then she handed me 50.

I still have the 50 like taped up somewhere in my closet. And I’m just like, I just cannot believe the growth in the last. 11 years. Like, but it also just feels like yesterday, you know, where I was like, so excited to finally be getting paid to do something that I love, like, and not like a paycheck from a boss.

Like it was like wild to me. So I started actually as a wedding photographer and love shooting weddings, shot weddings for a year, six, seven years. And then I decided to pivot into a new niche, which is like, I always have like these pivots in my business and it’s always so scary, but so fun. so exciting. I had a very established wedding photography business.

I quit my job, my full time job to do wedding photography full time. And I started, you know, I have, I started my family. I got married, had a baby and I was just like, I don’t want to be shooting 10 hour wedding days every Saturday from April to September. Like I’m missing out on quality time. So I pivoted to.

Branding, branding, photography. And then as I was doing that, it’s like another pivot came because all these photographers were like, I’ve seen you pivot from weddings to branding. How did you do that? And I didn’t really have the intention to, like, I loved educating already, but I didn’t have the, any intention to like make a course or do anything like that.

And I was talking to jazz and star about it. And I was like, you know, people really want to know how I did this. How can I help? And she gave me the best business advice ever that I still think about anytime I think of a pivot. And she said, you need to buy where the land is cheap and build a high rise.

And she was like, she’s like, people are wanting the information. There’s not a lot of information out there. Create the information, create the community. So I created, uh, for a lot of free resources for photographers. I created courses, I’ve created coaching. I have a retreat coming up. And it just like, that was just another pivot of pivoting from.

a brand photographer to like a brand photography educator and a coach. And I’ve had hundreds of students go through my programs and literally have just built amazing brand photography businesses. And I’m just like, this is what happens when you listen to your audience and you take inspired action.

Because I think about the people who paved the way before me, I learned about wedding photography from jazz and star from Caitlin James. And I’m like, if they Never created content. I don’t know where I’d be. I’d be like splicing things together from like Google and and whatever. And so I think about every time I’m like, should I do this?

Can I help people? Like the more that I put myself out there, the more other people can learn and get better. And I and I see that in my community and my students and how a lot of them have just gone through and they are thriving now. And it pushes me to continue to continue that. And so then a couple years ago, 2021, the top of the year, I was diagnosed with breast cancer.

And it’s just, it was a rug pull. It was a rug pull. You know, I had two small kids and as a mom, I, and this might just be me, like my biggest fear has always been something happening to my kids. And I had never thought, About me getting sick, my husband getting sick. Like I I’ve always just had those typical mom worries of like something happened to the kids.

And so I like mentally and emotionally, I didn’t, I didn’t know how to function. Like, I was just like, okay, I found a lump, you know, let me go to the doctor. And the doctor’s like, Hmm, let’s, you know, you’re only 33. Let’s have your first mammogram because I feel it too. Let’s just, let’s just see if it’s there.

They found two lumps and cut two, what? Surgery to six months of chemotherapy to five weeks of radiation, literally from January to December of that year. Was an active treatment doctor told me how to do chemo. I would lose my hair. I told my husband to buzz it I went bald it took years for it to go back and it’s just like It’s it’s just so difficult like the emotional state that I was in I look back and i’m like How did I get out of the bed?

Every morning, like the fear I had that whole year that things would go really south and it was just such a scary time. And the one thing that really helped me and my husband gave me the advice. I literally would go throughout the day and, you know, be mom to my kids and show up on social media and do my business and blah, blah, blah.

And as soon as I closed the bedroom door in my kid’s room at eight o’clock at night, I would go in my bedroom and just cry. from like eight to like midnight and my husband would come in like bring me ice cream go out come back in talk to me i’m just like i just let me cry this was like while i was doing the chemo and all that stuff and he said You should just like, um, search your, like, search your cancer on social media and see if there are other people talking about it.

And I did, and that was life changing because I was seeing these women, one, being alive, which was my biggest fear, and two, like, living, like, on vacation and, and running businesses and being a mom and all these things. And I would, you know, me, girl, I’m an extrovert. I would send a DM and, and they’d be like two years, you know, cancer free.

And I’d send a DM and I’m like, Oh, I was just diagnosed. I saw your stories. This is so inspiring. And they, some girls are like, here, take my number. Like text me, call me. I would get on the phone with. Random women and, and that helped me so much because it’s such a lonely feeling of like, you know, my husband listens, my family listens, but like nobody understands, um, especially like people, they’d be like, Oh, like, well, you can talk to my, my, my grandma, who’s 60.

And it’s just like, it’s just a very different season of life. And I was like, I want to talk to other moms, other mompreneurs. Like, can I, can, can anybody connect me? Can anybody, I literally would put on stories. Like, can anybody catch It was like a dating profile. I was like, I need a cancer survivor within the ages of this, with this many kids and people were just like, here you go, here you go.

It’s like, it was just like, people would just send me so many people. And so I immediately became that person for other people. I was like, I’m going to take my audience through the mess. And through everything that I’m going through, because I know that there’s somebody a year from now, two years from now, five days from now, that’s going to, this is going to happen to them and they’re going to go to social media.

And I want to be that person for them. And girl, this was, I think I’m, it’s 2024. This was three years ago and I have had so many. people on Instagram said, Hey, a friend showed me your profile or, Hey, I found you on, you know, a hashtag of the specific type of cancer that I have. I’ve been diagnosed and I’m those people.

Here’s my number. What’s your address? So I can send you a book and you’re, you know, like, let’s talk. And so many of them have said like, I found a lump and I’m glad that I, Saw your stuff because it convinced me to go to the doctor and now I have stage 2 breast cancer I’m just like it it goes back to our conversation earlier It’s like to just share to just share what is going up the highs the lows like it can truly Help somebody it could save somebody’s life like literally sharing what you’re comfortable with and so It’s been crazy.

Like, I am cancer free is what they, they don’t even say cancer free anymore. They say NED, no evidence of disease. I’m like, what is that crap? Like, come on, like, stop. But, you know, on social media, I am very, you know, um, extroverted. I choose joy. I’m in gratitude all the time. And, and before we hit the record button, you and I were talking and I was like, it’s still hard.

Like, it’s still, So hard. I’m not going to go and get on Instagram and cry every day. Like that’s like, that’s not helping anybody. Like I want to speak positivity. I meant I have to, I have to speak positively because my mind can go in a totally different direction. And so it’s like, I’m literally forcing myself to choose joy, to choose gratitude.

To choose my faith, but it’s hard Akua. It is so hard. I still do like, uh, treatments. I still do like, I, I thought, Oh, once you’re diagnosed and you go through chemo and all that stuff and you’re cancer free, you’re done. No girl, you got to take pills for the next five to 10 years. You got to go to the amputation center.

I get a, I get a, um, a needle. I literally sit in the chemo chair that I got my chemo in every six months. and get a needle in my arm and get infused with it’s not chemo, but it’s still the process. I’m still sitting around, you know, um, people doing chemo and it’s like, man, the morale, it’s like, you have to try so hard.

And I think that’s why I choose joy because I have to like, Not fake it till you make it, but like faith it till you make it. Like to like launch a program or like do coaching or do a photo shoot on a Monday. And then, you know, I go to the cancer center one, two, three times a month, blood work, follow ups, treatment, all that stuff.

So just do something amazing on a Monday. Like, like today, I’m going to record this podcast with you tomorrow. I have to get a shot in my stomach that I get every 28 days at the cancer center. And it’s like, it’s crazy. It’s like, so high vibe, you know, energetic. Choosing joy and then oh, yeah, I forgot I also had cancer and it’s got a risk of coming back So I’ve got to do four hours in the cancer center.

Like it sucks. It sucks. And this is like the first time I was telling you I’m gonna have to record a podcast about this. This is like the first time I’ve like been so Honest about that. Like it freaking sucks, but immersing myself in community, in joy, like going to church, like doing like my, my quality of life as far as like my day to day, like what I do with my family, like, Oh girl, every, I’m a yes mom now.

Like, Oh, you want to go to Disney world? Yeah. Yeah. You want to go to California for a month? Yeah. Yes. Like you want to go to the farmer’s market? Like I. I try so hard to create such an amazing life because life is so short. It is so short. And you know what, Akua? So many of the women that helped me through social media, like, Hey, here’s my number.

Da da da da da. A handful of them have passed away. In three years, women who told me it’s going to be okay, you’re going to be fine. I’ve gone through this literally as recent as last week. I saw one of them on social media. Her husband posted that she had passed away and we had, this is me getting real vulnerable.

We had the same cancer, same diagnosis, same treatment plan, same age. And it’s like the day before I’m planning this retreat, I’m getting all excited. I’m putting together my registration page and the next day. She passes away and I’m just like Man, life is so short. It is so, it’s so short. And, and, I don’t even know where I’m going with this.

I just know that this is why I choose The Joy, because I don’t want the alternative. I, I don’t want to think about a lot of negativity. Like, I don’t want to think about, like, drama, don’t know her. I don’t know her. You really are very unproblematic. Like, girl, I don’t care. People say crazy stuff in my DMS or, Oh, did you know so and so would talk about you?

I don’t care. Yes. Girl, life is short. You think I care what somebody thinks about me? If you’re not paying my bills, I’m not paying you any attention. Like, I just, I just don’t. Care, like even my relationship with my husband is different after this. Cause I’m like, nah, whatever. Like, you know, before it’s like, he says something I don’t like.

I’m like, let’s have a long conversation. No, I’m just like, nah, life is short. You know, like I just, so many things roll off my shoulders. Now, if something really bothers me. Then, you know, it’s gotta be a big deal. like, really? I pissed Angie off. Yeah. I really don’t, I don’t know. And it’s like you try to like look at, um, Caitlyn James, I talked to her a lot about this.

She talks about like finding the purpose in your pain. Yes. And so I feel like so many things have. Improved in my life after this, like my relationship with my husband has improved my relationship with my kids have improved. My friendships are stronger. My faith in God is stronger. I know that I’ve helped so many women on the back end of this that are getting into this.

Like I’m I every day I’m choosing joy, choosing gratitude and choosing to find the purpose And all of this, but I’m not going to lie. It sucks. It sucks. Yeah, it sucks. But, um, you know, I have a lot of great days. I have very few bad days, but I have a lot of great days. And I, and I think about the pivots, like starting with weddings, going into branding, going into branding, photography, education, becoming like kind of like a voice for breast cancer.

It’s just crazy how. Your life can really evolve, you know, and I think about five years from now, 10 years from now, like, what am I going to be talking about? What am I going to be offering? Like, I feel like the opportunities are endless. And that’s another thing I’ve took from this is like my, I used to have a lot of like limited beliefs about what I could say, who I could reach out to, what platform I can be on.

Like I said, girl, I don’t care. I’m going to try everything. I’m going to get my coins. I’m going to audition for the circle and big brother and all these things. And I’m going to reach out to this really, this really cool celebrity that I like and ask them if they need branding photos. Like I, there’s just like, I don’t care.

Like I’m going to live for me, for my family and for my faith. And it’s just like. You just have to live that way. And I, I, I coach a lot of photographers and just the limited beliefs. So many of them have, they’re so worried about what my, my sibling thinks or my husband thinks, or this random person I went to high school with.

And I’m like, you’re standing in your own way. 

Akua: But let’s talk about that though. Let’s, because, you know, I just love number one, everything that you shared has been so impactful. I have been like, yes, yes, yes. And the thing is just like how brave you have become now that like your whole outlook of life has just changed.

And so like you welcome, um, anything that comes your way within your business. And so like, And obviously like you’ve had a very big situation that’s like forced you to write. I think that’s happened to like a lot of us of like, we are so afraid of what people are going to think of us. Then we’d have something that forces to have to change that way.

And so like, as you like are coaching your clients, how, how are people working through that? Like how, cause it’s so much easier said than done and so, especially for you with everything that you’ve been through and you’re like, I don’t, I just go for it.

And it’s true. Like I think about my own self, like there have been times where I have been like, So caught up in what I have, like, what people are going to think of me and it’s so exhausting when you think that way, where sometimes I’ve been like, screw it, I don’t care, I’m just going to do it and let’s see what happens.

And I have been so pleasantly surprised. Right? It’s just, it’s wild. It’s so, it’s just, it’s a very different mindset to think of. But like, I love how you like, you’re constantly in that way. You’re like, look, it’s either a yes, and if it’s a no, that’s okay. Like, you, and like, it’s, it’s, it’s. You just to see how your business has evolved so much, it’s really just by you taking a chance, you’re taking a chance and and doing it and it has just evolved so beautifully.

And then I, this just popped up into my mind too, because I officially met you at the Creative Educator Conference, but I saw you at the last United. 

Angie: That’s right. Uhhuh. . Uhhuh . I don’t, did we like, I don’t even know if we talked like very briefly. Girl, we danced on the dance floor. I have a video We Dance of you and Laylee dancing

Akua: That was, yes, we danced. Yes. Okay. Yes. Okay. And then I had heard so much about you. Mm-Hmm. . And I remember like your hair was just growing down. Oh yeah. I was like, actually I had like a little buzz cut. But you look beautiful though, girl. I was like, she can pull it off, girl, 

Angie: pull it off. Lemme tell you. Low maintenance sis,

I, if I had to, you know, if I, I always joke like. I don’t know if you’ve seen the episode of Fear Factor years ago where the girl had to buzz her whole hair for like 25, 000. If you would have asked me four years ago, oh, absolutely not. Today, I’ll do it for 1, 000. I don’t care. It’s low maintenance. It’s cute.

I’ll take it. 

Akua: Oh my gosh. But I just, but to your point of just like you being there and then you won that award. But. Hmm. Just a community, like truly just seeing so many people that have came to like rally behind you. Cause I like, I said, I had seen like your story off of other people’s pages that I didn’t follow before I had officially met you at United and then like creative educator conference.

Okay. So like now everything’s coming back to me, but I just remember like everything that you shared was just the, it’s just the importance of community and then how you have now turned around and how you pour into other business owners, how you pour into other people that are going through the same thing that you’re going through and.

Just, I think again, it’s like there is purpose and everything that we have walked through. And I think sometimes we forget that of like, you’re going through a really crappy season, but this is preparing you. You are in a season of preparation for the next thing that’s going to happen to you because now you’ve built this beautiful business, this amazing life, like where you did go to California for a month and you can tell like you are truly living.

You are living and your business is helping you prepare that. And so even just. And I struggle with this too of like somebody who struggles a lot with like my identity in my work. 

Angie: Yeah. 

Akua: And was that like that for you before? And then how is it like that for you now as a business owner? Like how do you view entrepreneurship now after everything that you’ve just walked through?

Angie: That is such a good question. I, I’ve always been a workaholic. Like, I just, I love to work. I love to feel like I’m making a difference. And before, you know, before cancer, it was a lot of working until 2 a. m., you know, after the kids were down, waking up at 6 early. Like, I was just, my identity was really wrapped up in Being a business owner.

And when this season came and I was losing, one thing about me, I’m a control freak. I I’m a control freak. I it’s hard for me to have a VA because I’m looking over everything that they’re doing. Like I just, I, I’m just like, okay, let me prove that 10 times before you put, like, it’s hard for me. And so to be in this season of no control.

Was so tough. Like having a doctor tell you like, you’re going to do six months of chemo. You’re going to feel like crap. You’re not going to want to do anything. I’m like, but how am I going to work? You know, like how, like in the home, it’s like, okay, Sean can take over a lot of the duties I was doing while I’m doing chemo with the kids.

Like they’re there. I have help, but like in my business. That’s where I’m like, I want all of the control because I feel like, and it’s not true. I feel like I’m the only one that can move the needle forward in my business. So I have to be doing all the things. And this year I’ve hired a VA, I’ve hired an integrator, a project manager.

I’ve had a, um, a team, an actual team working with me and it’s like showing me, and I’ve, I’ve, it was like, I had to force myself to do that. Cause I’m like, I can’t. Do everything I need to start outsourcing. I need to start not only outsourcing, but letting people grow in my business. And this year was the first year I’ve really done that.

And now I’m just like, this was necessary. This was necessary. Like, I can’t do all the things. And now I’m starting to bring in people who are experts at certain things. And so it takes away a lot of that. Well, now I’ve got to train this person. Now I’ve got to, I’m bringing in like, For my programs, a Facebook ads specialist.

She knows what she’s doing. Great. I’m bringing in a launch strategist. Great. You know, it’s just like all these different things in my business that I was doing every single piece 24 seven when I’m not parenting my kids, I’m like, I need to also like have my own identity of Angie McPherson, not the business owner, not the photographer.

Can I just sit on my couch and watch an episode of the Kardashians? And relax like that’s, that, that can be very hard for me. Cause I feel like this email needs to be answered. Let me do this. Let me do that. But the more that, that this season has really pushed me to let go of control in different parts of life, it’s really kind of like folded over into my business.

Like we have certain things that I have help around the house now, you know, maybe once or twice a year I’ll have somebody do like a deep clean of the house and that’s great because I don’t, they can like wipe the baseboards and stuff like that and it’s just even Somebody gave me a coupon for laundry service one time, like a free laundry service.

And we put all our laundry, they had it folded, they had it organized. And I was like, wow, like there are, there are things in my life that I can let go of. It doesn’t have to be on a consistent basis, on a permanent basis, but when you’re going through a season where you know you need help, get help. And that is my biggest thing.

It is hard for me to ask for help. It is so hard for me. And I think that’s the control freak in me. It’s just like, I don’t even know. I need to like unpack this with my, my therapist. I don’t know what the real issue is for me to ask for help because I’m quick to help somebody. 

Akua: I love. Yes. You love to help other people, but you, it’s, it’s an ego thing.

That’s because that’s, I’m, it’s a huge ego thing, right? Like, I feel like for me, when I ask for help, um, even in my business, you know, I feel like I’m a huge burden, even when I literally ask for help still, I’ll be like, I’m sorry to bother you and people, but I’m paying you. Like, you know, I’m willing to give you my card and swipe, you know, but it’s wild where I, even when I’m still seeking for help in my business, like when I hired, I have a copywriter who writes my blog posts.

Like, that’s kind of where I’ve just been starting with like wanting to expand and she is amazing. But I remember when I first reached out to her, I was like, um, hi, uh, I’m drowning and this is very important for me in this season of my life. And so, you know, like, can you help me? And I just remember how I was so timid and I felt so guilty that I like, Was not the person writing my blogs.

I feel like it’s just like, I felt like I was less of a business owner because I was not doing everything. Then I felt like I was a fraud. And I just was like, that is the most wild assumption that you can make because we’re only one person. And then I just had to remind myself like Akua, to your point, like, It’s okay to ask for help.

And then it’s like, but it’s also to where that’s where my identity was rooted in as a business owner. Like I had to still, and I’m still working on it to this day where, where when people ask, like, Hey, I’m a cool, I always feel like naturally I need to tell them what I do. Like, that’s where it feels the value.

Like, Oh yeah, I’m an entrepreneur. Like, right. Like as if like, and it’s like, no, number one, nobody cares. And two, it’s like, that’s where I have even been like, Oh, cool. Like what else? Other things you like to do? Like, right. We are more than our businesses. And I stand by that. And I say it almost every single episode where I’m like, now, like, let me actually do hobbies where like, I’m doing voiceover acting, voiceover ads now.

Right. We’re like, I have more other identities that are outside of my business, but then like, I get some of my best ideas from doing the most random things ever. And just things that I get to voiceover. That gives me joy that I can pour into to where like, I’m able to now have more excitement and joy in my business.

And so I love how you just shared all of that because it’s so true as business owners. Like we do get so caught up, especially when we’re in a lot of groups and like we spend a lot of our time with other entrepreneurs and like, that’s all we can talk about is our jobs, which there’s nothing wrong with that, but it really does put you in like.

a bubble in a sense of like, and sometimes it’s hard to switch out of it. 

Angie: Girl, let me tell you, I’m so glad you said that because we do like social media groups, like Facebook groups, in person groups, we really are surrounded by our peers in this. Sometimes it’s, Challenging to go to lunch or dinner with maybe a friend from college or a friend from high school that is not an entrepreneur.

Not an entrepreneur. Yes. Yeah. I’m like, what do we talk about? And that is how wrapped up we are. We are identity because I’m like, I should be able to hold a conversation. Not about entrepreneurship, not about photography with anybody. Like. It’s so funny to me. I have to take a moment and this is my default.

Let me just ask about them. Like, what are you, what’s going on with you right now? 

Akua: What’s happening girl? Like, and I’ll just keep putting it on now. I’m like, don’t ask me cause it’s going to, it’s going to go to my business. Like, I, yes. And I will say though, like it’s hard, but as I said, I love going to business with fellow entrepreneurs, so we’ll be like, Asks about business, then like, Oh, tax right off, right, right.

Yeah. Write it off. It’s so funny. 

Angie: This Mexican meal is all of a sudden a business meeting. 

Akua: All right. But you know, but it’s so true though. I mean, it is like, even when I, yeah, like I have a lot of business friends and even in my season of like moving to a city where I don’t know anybody, like I moved to Chicago nine months ago, full transparency.

I have no friends. Outside of my entrepreneur, you’re shocked. You’re shooketh. But every single weekend when Ruth, she was, she was on our podcast, Steve, love her, but she would ask me every single Monday meeting of Did you leave the house today, Akua? Did you leave the house this weekend, Akua? Like, cause she would ask, cause she knew.

She’s like, you’re too wrapped up in your job. You need to go out and make friends. You moved, you just moved to a new city. It’s very isolating. Like she had to keep me in check. And have I left? No. It’s rough. It’s rough. And that’s, but I’m actually like, literally, I now have started planning like dates with myself of like, to actually see what Chicago has to offer and stuff like that.

Because like, Again, like I want to be able to enjoy my business and some of that, but like, I just, I don’t want it to be like, that’s all I see. But anyways, to your point, it is, it’s really hard to like turn off, but I feel like you, we have to turn off as entrepreneurs because that’s how you’re going to be able to build a sustainable business is because you are happy.

Your business is not there to make you happy, right? Like when you are happy. That’s how you build, like, create a successful business. And so I think, again, we have to really just be much more intentional about taking care of ourselves and also to be much more intentional of spending that time with people outside of our business as well, whether that be family, having those other friends.

But yeah, no, I feel like there’s a lot of us where, like, we are so engulfed in that space, which is great. And it’s amazing. And just love that. Truly, it’s such a joy. But yeah, it is hard. It can be difficult sometimes to build relationships outside of, of entrepreneurship. 

Angie: Yeah, and when it comes to me with my day to day, like identity, what I’ve done in the past couple weeks, it’s been so helpful is drop the kids off at school and preschool.

The old Angie would literally run to the laptop. And start work. And the past couple of weeks, the weather has been so nice here in Virginia. I don’t even touch the laptop. I get up with the kids. I get dressed to basically go for a walk, drop them off, come home. And I walk two miles every morning before I even come home and touch my computer.

And it is like me mentally telling myself, you need to choose you. You need to choose you. Before anything else, before that email, before that Instagram reel, before whatever, go outside, the weather is beautiful, and of course you just feel better in fresh air, and I walk two miles, and It’s done so much for me.

It’s just done so much for my mental. Like, I don’t have to just work, work, work. I don’t have to feel like people need something from me all the time. Like I can actually choose me. Like, and it’s like, I don’t have to, you know, this is like my time. I’m not giving somebody a snack. I’m not doing anything.

I’m literally just walking and existing. And that can be such a freeing thing to just spend time existing and not having anybody need you for anything. Just relax. 

Akua: Yes. Just relax. Oh, I love that so much. I mean, I think, again, it’s just, I think with everything that you’ve been through, and even just, A question I had earlier, too, that I forgot to ask, but I wanted to ask now, is even when you were going through your treatments, were you still working as a business owner, or were you like, did you just take a complete break?

So you were still working. 

Angie: I was still working, but honestly, I did it because if I did not, I would be Remember I said I was crying from 8 to midnight? If I wasn’t working, it would be from 8 a. m. to midnight. Like, I was like, I need a distraction. I need to go through life normally so I don’t feel like this is uprooting my entire life.

So I had actually, I had just opened enrollment to one of my programs and was diagnosed like five days later. And I had to, it was a live program that I taught live every Monday for six weeks. And I had to go into that group and tell them I was diagnosed. I’m still going to be showing up and I’m so glad I did.

They were so understanding. They were comforting. I really still felt like I was still helping people and just having to do that. I said, I’m just going to continue to work. Of course, I’d scaled everything way back. I didn’t shoot as much. I didn’t launch my programs as much that year. Um, I didn’t travel too much, but I still had my, my week to week tasks and projects and things that really helped me to feel normal.

Because I feel like when you go through that season of diagnosis of treatment and things like that, you just feel like a cancer patient. And that is like the worst feeling you want to have. You don’t even want to, you don’t even think about cancer. I was like, whatever I can do to make me forget about what I’m going through, give it to me.

And so I was volunteering at my kid’s school quite often. I was working, I was shooting, I was hosting courses. I was going live on Instagram, talking about photography, like normal day to day tasks that helped me to balance out all the mess that was going on. I will 

Akua: say even within that, like, you still were choosing yourself, which is so beautiful.

Like, you were still, I don’t know if you, like, if you’ve noticed that, but even within that, of like, just even, having some sense of normalcy as when things just aren’t technically what we would consider normal, right? And you were like, no, like I’m still gonna be able to choose myself so I can still show up in a way that feels good to me.

And that is just, that’s just so beautiful. And it’s again, amazing how You were just honest with people with where you were at in your business and people still supported you. People still wanted to purchase from you, right? I think sometimes we always have this fear of like letting our clients down and stuff like that.

And a lot of times when you’re just really honest, they love that. They love that because they see you as human and they’re more willing to support you because of that honesty. So in the fact that you were still able to show up and, you know, Whatever you did was more than enough. And so that’s something too.

I just like to remind business owners, like whatever you’re doing for your clients is more than enough. Like they see what you’re doing. They love what you’re doing. And so like, I feel like sometimes too, like, I remember like when I first started out and I was like, Oh my God, like I, you know, when you get your first couple of clients, you’re like overexerting yourself.

I would answer emails late at night. Like I, like I had no sense, like, you know what I mean? And, and they would still answer it like nine to five. Like, you know what I mean? Friendships like a quip, they’ll be fine. If I just stopped doing that, right? And they sure were. They absolutely were. 

Angie: I, I feel like those early stages, you’re just like, I want to make everybody happy.

I want to over deliver. And still like years in, you’re still. You still over 

Akua: deliver. Yes. You can still honor yourself. Like I used to have sale calls Monday through Friday. Now you only get me on Wednesday for a couple hours. 

Angie: That’s the best. Like having one or two days a week where you. I love kind of like block scheduling like that.

Like one to two days where I take discovery calls or, um, coaching calls, things like that. I, I personally do like no meeting Monday. Like I don’t want any meetings where I got to be on zoom on a Monday because I got to choose me. I got to choose me and figure out what my week looks like. I even saved that for like my CFO day, like my financial stuff.

And. It’s just like, even Fridays, I’ve turned Fridays into casual Fridays. So it’s basically whatever I want to do. If I want to work, fine. If I want to go to the movies by myself, fine. If I want to volunteer, right. Like my, my son has field day on Friday, like Mondays and Fridays are sacred to me. Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, like, let’s party, like, let’s, let’s do whatever.

But I have to have these buffers where I can choose me and choose, you know, um, like a clear mindset on the beginning and end of my week. 

Akua: Oh yeah. So that you can function as a business owner. Like I realized even too with the podcast, like I say interviews on Mondays and I hated it just because the fact of like, I truly am not.

1000 percent there. You’re getting a fake Akua on a Monday. I’m just kidding. You don’t want Monday Akua. You don’t want Monday Akua. I’m just joking. No, but like, I just realized I just wasn’t like all there. And so now I will only take interviews from Tuesdays to Friday. And if I do have to do a Monday, because right, sometimes things just like, Life is life and other people’s schedule, you know, sometimes it just isn’t aligned.

I will make sure to do late afternoon Mondays. Cause then I’m like, okay, you’re already checked out. I’ve checked it. You know what I mean? Like Akua is here. She’s fresh. Cause like usually like late Monday and that’s like, all right, my week is actually like really started. You know what I mean? And so I totally get that.

Right. I think again, as I think the biggest thing that we can take from this conversation is just really choosing yourself. Number one, like you as a business owner, you’re more than your business, but if you want to build a sustainable business, To, you know, have more time to spend with your family to, you know, be there for your kids or, you know, just to travel more, whatever that looks like for you, choose yourself and do the things that make you happy so that you can show up and be the business owner that you want to be like the business owner that you dream of being.

Be that today, right? Like. Be that today. And so I, I think that’s just such a good thing. Like everything you’ve shared in this whole conversation has been amazing. And so for what it just overall, as you have looked at your whole journey, what would you want to say to business owners currently, whether they’re going through a good season, a hard season, whatever, whatever that looks like for people, what is the one piece of advice that you would give?

Angie: Oh man, I would say really to work on yourself. I feel like self development. Translates into business development. Like your, your business is not going to grow if you’re not growing internally. And that can mean something completely different for everyone. That can mean someone might need to work on their own limited beliefs.

Someone might need to go to therapy and unpack that trauma from 20 years ago. Someone might need to go to Jesus. You know, it’s just like, you have to, whatever that means for you. If you feel, and you can feel it, you can feel it. People might. It might have a mask on and oh, no, I’m fine. It’s all good. You can feel when you’ve hit some sort of like roadblock or when you’re in an obvious crazy season, like you can feel there’s something more for me.

There’s some and it and it really is just the mind. It is just the mind. Once you get your mind right and you’re never going to be perfect. It’s always An evolution of your mind. But once you get your mind right to be more self aware, more confident, um, just living in gratitude, like just being so thankful for what you already have.

Once you get your mind right and stop speaking so negatively to yourself and worrying about what everybody’s thinking of you and just living in fear. Once you get that mind right, Everything just kind of rose and I feel like with every pivot in my business within my personal life, it’s always stemmed from let me sit in quiet and let me journal like I do morning pages.

It’s literally three journal pages, a stream of consciousness, no prompts or anything every morning get up and I take pen to my notepad and I just write. Like one day it could be, I’m listing a hundred things I’m thankful for going from major things like people and experiences down to air and, and water and dirt in my, you know, like, whatever.

And, and one day it’s like, Oh, my gosh, my kids are in swimming lessons. Let me talk about all the growth. I’m saying it’s just the most random things and the more that I like, let these thoughts out and stop just keeping them all in. And I don’t know. I just find so much growth in all different aspects of life.

So I’m telling myself for the future, like, hey, if something ever happens in the future, just know, take the time and really focus on getting your mind, right? Mindset is really everything. It 

Akua: really is. I mean, a lot of times, you know, and I feel like that is the common thing I keep having with multiple guests in the show.

It’s like, everybody said it in such a different way, but it’s truly, it’s so true. Like mindset is just so, so key. And I love how you said like really that self development because even in this conversation, we are not the same person that we were just, you know, Two seconds ago, right? Like we are consistently evolving.

And so when you evolve as a business when you’re doing the work, you already naturally evolve and then your needs change. Your clients needs change like so many different things. And I think of my own journey of like, when I first started as a business owner, like I was like, okay, Instagram strategy is what I wanted to lean into.

I fricking hated it. I actually took a break for a year from my business. Like I was still doing business work, but like I had a lot of my clients on retainer. So I was doing a lot of the retainer work, but a lot of like, Instagram strategy. I hated it. And so like, I took that time out, right? Took that pause, journaled of like, what do I actually like to do?

Because that really matters as a business owner. I don’t want to resent the work that I’m doing and took that time to build the service that I have now that I love to be able to confidently speak about, share about, talk about. Till end on end, like, you know what I mean? And I think again, I wouldn’t have gotten there.

I wouldn’t have fully understood of like the direction I wanted to go into my business. If I didn’t take that time and I’m not saying you have to take a long break, not saying that at all. But I think again, it’s like, like really just putting that time to always just like pour into yourself, self development, no matter what that looks like, even if from a business standpoint of like, I need to work more on my productivity or a time management.

Okay, cool. Great. Or like, again, like I loved how you shared, it can really look different for. Anybody. And so love that. Oh, Angie, I have just loved this conversation because it’s just so life giving. And I just really appreciate just your honesty of like, what, how you have truly ran your business. I mean, you’ve been in the game for 11 years, right.

And like through all the highs and the lows that you have brought us into that journey and shared with us of like, and I hope that if you’re listening to just to know that. The business that it’s possible for you no matter what, right? Like no matter what, no matter what, right? Like you, we always have, I always think of that graphic of like how we view success.

Like, Oh yeah, it’s going to be this really straight line, but it’s like success, what success really looks like. And it’s like all these like scribbles everywhere. Like you definitely knew you wanted to have a successful business, but you didn’t know what the journey was going to look like for you to get there.

And so, but it was the fact that you still continuously chose yourself. You still continuously showed up day after day. And it’s like, okay, like, look, I’m not quitting, but I’m taking a break. And that’s okay. Right? Like you still honored yourself in that current season and relied on the people around you.

You asked for help, like those different types of things that I think, yeah, we heavily talked about life, but these are things that like you that carry on as a business owner, like you can’t run your business. Like, right. These things, they’re just also intertwined together. And so I just, I thank you so much.

And so every single question that we’d love to end with is what do you think is the biggest differentiator between the businesses that succeed and the ones that fail. 

Angie: They keep going. They keep trying. The only way to fail is to give up. It’s the only way to fail. If you keep going, you’re going to hit your goals because you’re not going to stop until you hit your goals.

So yes, keep going. Yes. 

Akua: Oh, I love that. So that’s like the perfect way to end this episode because, you know, entrepreneurship has shifted so much these past few years. And, you know, I think we saw a lot too a lot in the pandemic. A lot of businesses were closed. A lot of business owners, I feel like generally what I’ve seen, like some, like in my spaces, business owners that definitely have found their footing, but there’s also businesses owners that still have it, that are still recovering.

And so it’s just like, if you’re listening, like no matter what you’re going through, like keep going as a business owner. Like there’s a reason why you have this stream on your heart. Um, there’s a reason why you are an entrepreneur. So keep going. And so Angie, thank you. Thank you so much. And so for people that want to connect with you, where can they find you?

Angie: Yes. You can go to my website, Angie McPherson. com or hit me up on Instagram. That’s where I am every day. It’s at Angie Janine, and I’ll send you a little voice DM. If you DM me, I treat Instagram DMs like boxer. I’m always just saying like, Hey girl. 

Akua: Hey, what’s up? Video. Yes, exactly. Also to check out Angie’s podcast, because I was a guest on her show and it is so much fun.

And I had a Google 

Angie: on there. Y’all, if you haven’t heard the podcast, this is like the one where people are like hollering. They’re like, Girl, y’all are just a vibe. Y’all had a good time. I’m like, please listen to that episode. It’s all about storytelling and that is your specialty and you dropped so many gems.

So yes, make sure if any podcast that you or any episode, go to that one. 

Akua: You’ve had so many good ones though. You absolutely have. Yes. I love, love your podcast. So we will absolutely put in all of your information in the show notes. And thank you so much, Angie. I appreciate you. I love you. And thank you so much for being here.

Yes, absolutely. And for everybody listening until next time. Transcribed That ends our episode of the independent business podcast. Everything we’ve discussed today can be found at podcast. honeybook. com. Head to our website to access for show notes, relevant links, and all of the resources that you need to level up.

And if you’ve enjoyed today’s episode, be sure to subscribe to the podcast to make sure you never miss our future content, drop us a review and leave our guests some love on social. And thank you again for listening.