Akua: One in five independent business owners have lost money due to the lack of organization in their business. Creating systems that are strategic and efficient can be exactly what you need to propel your business forward. Today on the show, we sat down with Amber McHugh, the creator of the Modern CEO and how to clone yourself.

With the systems Amber implemented into her own business, she was able to turn her side hustle into a multi million dollar company. She shares with us how we can create systems that truly aligns with our values, the mindset shifts that we need to make and how to honor our boundaries. Now let’s get into the episode.

Hey everyone. This is your host, Akua Kanadu, and you’re listening to the Independent Business Podcast. More people than ever are working for themselves and building profitable businesses in the process. So on this show, I get to sit down with some of the most influential authors, entrepreneurs, and creators to break down the signs of self made success so that you can achieve it too.

Amber: Hello. Hello, Amber. How we doing? Oh my gosh. So 

Akua: good. So happy to be here with you. Oh my gosh. I’m so happy. And I like the outfit girl outfit to the glasses. It’s giving, I’m loving it. Yes. 

Amber: It is the outfit. It’s I put on the red lips when I’m like, you know what? I need a little something extra today. And today was, I was so looking forward to this call, but I had a lot of calls today and it was like, you know what?

Red lips. That’s it. That’s going to be the pick me. Red lips. 

Akua: Oh, love it. Oh my gosh. Yay. Well, I’m super excited to know more about you and your story. And I know our audience will be too. And just really about just systems, you know, systems aren’t necessarily the most sexiest thing when it comes to entrepreneurship, but it’s truly keen to running a successful business.

And I feel like you have done it all. Very, very well. And so I’m really excited just to learn like you have had an incredible journey from, you know, just being a single mom at 18 to owning three companies. Like as a systems person, how were you able to just really manage it all and find success? 

Amber: The only way it is possible is because I have that systems mindset.

We talk about this idea that if we didn’t clone ourselves, and that’s not necessarily cloning me, but right, replicating and getting that cloned feeling and just multiplying our results without the crunch on profitability and the crunch on our time. Absolutely would not have been possible. So they are the essential ingredient.

Akua: Yes, I love, I never even thought of that like a systems mindset because naturally I’m not like that. I truly, but I just realized I really had to train myself as a business owner um, to really get adjusted with that because with my own personal journey, I left my job, I had no backup plan, and And I was like, I got like a month to make this happen.

Otherwise I’m moving back in with mom. And so I was like, I got to figure this out, but systems was not at the top of my priority. Right. It was like, I need to get clients. I need to get, um, you know, I need to be able to pay my bills. But once things started going, I was drowning. I was exhausted, drowning.

And I, Just realized I didn’t really have a systems mindset. And even still to this day, I’m training myself to have a systems mindset because I feel like naturally, if you are more so an organized person, it’s easier to fall into systems. But systems is something I’ve just never really enjoyed. And I like begrudgingly implemented them, but then I’m like.

Why didn’t I do that earlier? So now I’m actually really like four years into my business. Now I’m loving systems where I’m like, how can I really like automate this in a way to where I just don’t have to worry about it and I can focus on the things that I need to focus on. And so I love that. That’s such like a good, good key.

Yeah. Such a good thing. 

Amber: You’re spot on. And I think that I, there are things in my life, like things get messy and that causes stress for me. So systems are my way of alleviating the stress. Like simple example, my husband, we have one car right now and my husband drives it most often. It’s really his car.

And he takes the keys and he puts them in his bag. And where are they? Where is the bag? Where are the keys? I don’t know. But when I drive the car. Where are the keys? Oh, I hung them up on that hook by the door. And he’s like, oh, good idea. And eventually he got on and was like, babe, where are the keys? He’s like, I hung them up by your hook on the door.

And it alleviates so much of the stress that can pop up. Like, where are things? What do we need to do? I don’t know. What did we do last time? Right? Oh, let’s systematize this. So things smooth sailing. Yes. 

Akua: And so you used to work too. I’m really interested because you used to work in like organizational development.

How exactly did you start working with independent business owners? 

Amber: Oh my gosh. So fun. So organization development is essentially a doctor for your business. Things aren’t working quite the way we want. There’s something that’s off. We’re not getting the result, you know, all sorts of things we can assess in an organization at a large scale.

But also at a small scale and my heart and my passion really, I love working with small business owners. So that was the shift I started to make. We started our business and like, Oh, but I still like business and I want to be in business with people. And so that was the pull through like big business first, which was fun.

Really? Like I enjoyed. my corporate roles in my corporate career, but my heart is really with people and small businesses like people are the heart and soul of all businesses. But man, in a small business, we are like, we’re doing it. So that’s, that’s where the heart came for from an organizational development perspective, pulling through to our small businesses.

Akua: Oh, I love that so much. So already naturally you’re like, I’ve always been a very organized person just naturally, which I love. And, but also too, but it’s true. Like we truly being able to have that connection that would be able to building those relationships with your business owners. There’s nothing like it.

And I think even for me, that’s where I’ve also really shifted my mindset about systems because I’m like, that gives me the freedom to connect more with my My clients to be able to build more of those relationships giving the best client experience as possible and so I think that’s just such a good thing of When you are creating those systems like really thinking about how the time that you have will be freed up To connect and pour into the people that you absolutely clients and even outside of that like even in life as well And so I think that’s Such a, such a good reminder of it’s the people that you’re serving.

That’s why you’re doing this for. And so, cause you know, it’s not really fun. Like one in five independent business owners have lost money due to the lack of organization, which is not a fun, yeah, I’m one of them. And so, and it is, it is not a fun thing. I will openly admit that. Yes, I have absolutely been one of them.

And so I think again, it’s just one of those reminders of. Think of the people that you’re serving when you are truly creating those systems. And so another thing I’m really curious about is that there’s so many systems that we need to have as independent business owners that we could set up in our business.

So what would you define as a system and how does it play a role in your business? 

Amber: Oh man, so systems are there whether you explicitly define them or identify them or not. So systems I look at as the who, what, where, when, why. The W’s. Who, what, where, when, why is what’s happening here, right? So that’s how I start to think about and break down a system.

And an example of this is you walk into your favorite coffee shop. They are prepared. for you to place an order. And once that order comes in for your tall, iced caramel macchiato, actually I’d, I’d go for a cold foam right now. Cold brew with some cold foam, sweetened please. That would be ideal. And if, if we can pull out the pumpkin, I would be a okay with that.

Uh, even though it might be out of season, but you go in and you place that order. And what do you get at the end? Ideally, there is a system and a flow and steps in place that this isn’t going to take 30 minutes. And it’s going to be fairly quick. And at the end, you get what you asked for. And that is the goal of systems.

There is an input. There’s a need for a process to be executed, a set of steps. Who, who needs this done? Where are we doing it? Why are we doing it? Okay. And etc, etc, etc. So walking through those W’s to the end so we deliver a great drink, a great deliverable, a great website, great phone, like whatever that is.

And it’s one part experience, but it’s also delivering the great product. And then, ideally you do that with efficiency. So that you’re not taking 30 minutes of coffee because that would not be a great experience. Just 

Akua: the thought of that doesn’t sit right with my spirit, honestly. Just waiting 30 minutes for my drink.

But it’s so true though, like systems really are everywhere. And if you really just think about like your day to day life, I didn’t even think of that. I’m like, oh yeah, like even going to the grocery store, right? And you can go into self checkout or don’t go through the self checkout. That’s all a system in place to make sure that you can get what you need.

And I’m like, Oh my goodness, that is actually such a good point. But when you said the who, what, where, when, why, and how, I think to even really just to add to that really honing in on the, why I think that is so, so key, like why you’re doing it. Think of the bigger picture, because then I think it really adds more importance as to why you need to have the systems in place.

And I think a lot of us as businesses, we know that and. Either we don’t do it or we do do it, but we’re not also taking that time to really refine and really identify those gaps that we need to figure out and how to make it as efficient as possible. So that is just, I think that’s just those, that exercise I think is just such a key way into just really expanding our mind and having a better understanding of how truly systems can really impact your life.

So I love that so much. Like, Oh, my mind is already like, 

Amber: I love it. And you hit on something key with that. Why there personally, why am I doing this? And you’re going to connect to that, right? Okay. Is this serving the why? Like, is this process serve that wire? Do we have extra steps in there? Can we be a little bit more efficient because this is our why?

And also, if you’re working with other people, contractors, team members, et cetera, communicating the why for anyone else who’s executing that process is such a next level level activity that is so simple. Because if I understand, if I’m executing a system that you’ve designed or you’re asking me to do something and you say, Oh, by the way, this is why I went, Oh, okay.

If things come up, then I will be able to identify this doesn’t match to our why it’s just going to take everything to the next level. I will be able to deliver on that with a whole new perspective. So it’s good for you. It’s good when you’re working with other people all around next level. 

Akua: Yes, I love that.

Again, like delivering with like a different perspective, and I think that’s where it key, where you, I’ll just bring it back to what you said earlier, of just like that systems mindset. A question I’m really curious about because, you know, as a former corporate girlie, you know, you essentially, what, Corporations are, it’s full of systems.

So what are some systems that you have seen implemented in that space that could be really beneficial for independent business owners? Oh my gosh, my 

Amber: go to on this, the place to start is, this is a simple one and sometimes you can get stuck in this or, I find two things, people can get stuck in it or they completely avoid it, but you gotta do it and get a system in place so you can do it well.

Your strategic planning and your system for implementing. In fact, one of my clients, Becky Launder, worded this so well. She said, I knew I need a system in my life for reaching my goals. Like, oh, yes. Like, how well worded. So that would be a key system. Strategic planning and your implementation cycles.

There is a rhythm to that. And if you can get a system in place around that, that’s great. That is just going to accelerate everything you do. And of course things trickle down from there. So I would start there. But what’s 

Akua: so interesting, I’ve never heard that like your systems for implementation, I would love for us to like break that down because especially as we are strategic planning and goal setting and, you know, um, in our business, especially right now in Q2, I know a lot of us are going back and, and rethinking things and resetting in our business and strategizing.

What does that look like with, you know, implementation systems? 

Amber: Yeah. So, I start at the top with, if this is where we’re going, our roadmap, our strategic plan, our goals, our objectives, that is typically done annually, but we want to look back to that regularly. Every quarter, we want to look at, okay, what are we going to implement?

What do we need to do to stay on track with those goals? If we wait until the end of the year, like, okay, wait, are we on track to our goals? Wait? Oh, no, we should know well in advance if we’re on track or not So from a systems perspective we go through a workflow where we’re going to look back What did we accomplish in the last quarter in the last 90 days in the last six weeks whatever your decided system or cycle is?

Okay, what did we accomplish what worked? Well, what didn’t and then we’re going to look ahead Okay, that’s where we are But this is where we want to be or where we want to be going What do we need to do to accomplish that? And I use a simple 90 day or a six week planning cycle based on where you are, and we’re going to map it out.

What are you doing throughout the next six weeks or 90 days? And what are the milestones I need to accomplish, again, to stay on track with my goals? And then we pull that right through to, uh, every month. I want to check in. All right. This is what I said I needed to get done. Here we go. And this is calendarized.

So there is a system and a flow around it. It’s not, you know, it’s not willy nilly. It’s like, no, this is on the calendar. I’m doing this. And then every Monday and Friday, we systematize and book end that with our Monday. CEO time and our Friday’s CEO time, and every day. Now, and this sounds like a lot, but if you are regularly checking in with your goals, and you’ve got a system and a framework for this, this is happening fast, and it’s integrated into your workflow, so if it, if it sounded to anyone like, man, this sounds like a little bit of work, This is like minutes that is going to accelerate your progress.

In fact, the research shows slow down to speed up. When you pause to build a plan, you are going to implement faster. And I would argue it’s probably going to be a whole lot better because you’re not flying by the seat of your pants. 

Akua: Oh my gosh, yes, I love that so, so much. I think, again, it’s, you really broke it down into really digestible steps.

And again, like, where you have Monday where you’re prepping for CEO day, and then you have that Friday where you’re actually implementing. I think a lot of the times too, I have learned even myself, I need to prep quite a bit for certain things. Even like, for example, With the systems that I’ve created with social media.

Like I have to prep before I can even record before I can even, you know, create my captions. Like there’s so much prepping and stuff involved. And even too, when you do have your CEO days, like if I am really trying to lean more into time blocking, that’s naturally what I do, which has been really helpful for me.

But I, that I have to prep before I can even implement in that time. I have realized that. But then when you are finally. Implementing it, it goes so much smoother when you prep. So I feel like the real work is in the prep, not the actual, like when you’re implementing it, because that, because when, then it’s like, when you finally have the plan now, like I’m, I’m pushing out content, you know, I’m doing these things X, Y, Z a lot more faster.

And so for. I’m really curious to know, even to add to that question, is life happens, right? Like, and somebody who’s, people are always like, I’m so, like, how are you finding the time even with, if things don’t go to a plan, or again, something happens in life, how do you adjust? Like, what, what are some of your thoughts of the things that you do?

Amber: Yeah, absolutely. You’re spot on. Nothing goes to plan. Life doesn’t go to plan. The, the market conditions, the client schedules, nothing goes to plan. So we’ve got to build in margin. If we have our schedule packed, you know, let’s say we’ve got a plan to work 40 hours a week and every single moment is booked.

Ooh. Okay. We don’t have a lot of margin in there. So a lot of the research supports only booking. 60 to 80 percent of your calendar. I lean toward the 60 percent cause I like a little bit extra margin. I don’t want to live my life right up to the edge there. So I plan for about 60 percent of my week, but the other 40 percent I have space so that when things come up, I’m like, okay, I’m good.

I can move things around. We can easily adjust. And I do think you’ve got to be ready for that. And you’ve got to leave margin for it and have the mindset that, okay, This didn’t go to plan, but you got a plan so you can easily go through this. And the other thing that I recommend is spending a very short amount of time, just doing a little bit of scenario planning.

If you’ve got a big launch, a new product launch, a big project, like do a bit of scenario planning. Okay. If what could happen here, maybe my ads don’t go as well. I planned them to, um, maybe that client doesn’t sign the contract, maybe so and so cancels, whatever those worries that come up in your mind, don’t dwell on that because that’s counterproductive for a lot of reasons, but spend just a few minutes thinking, okay, if that happens, I’ll do this because then if it does happen, you’re good.

Like, okay, yeah, I got, I got an idea. This is a little bit of a pain, but I can shimmy some things because I have margin and I’ve already thought through this a little, so it’s not as big of a deal as it could have been. 

Akua: Yes. Oh my gosh. That’s such a, So, so key. Margin. Like, I love how you, like, you found a percentage.

Like, you know what? I’m going to leave, just do up to 60%. And so then I have that space just to breathe. But also too, I love how you said, like, thinking of scenarios, but not spiraling, because I think when you start to think of certain scenarios, it forces you to be more innovative and more strategic.

Especially, like, if you’re not hitting specific goals that you want to hit, then you’re not You can still change and pivot within that plan, right? Like if you have like not dwelling on it, but you’re like, all right, I potentially anticipated this and now this isn’t going, but I’ve already thought this through, so maybe now I’ll try this and experiment because everything that we do in our business is experimentation, everything.

And so, you know, not getting attached to that outcome, but you know, as you’re planning really again, like from that mindset shift of like, you know, having that systems mindset, but also realizing that you, this whole thing is an experiment. Right. Everything. And so it’s all just data output that you’re, you, that you’re going to use, um, to make the next best decision for your business.

And so I absolutely love that where I’m like, ah, cause I’m always like, I’m a six on the Enneagram. So we will think of like the worst possible outcome. So that’s why I’m like, to me, I’m like. Oh yeah. Like, because that’s always me in my mind consistently. I’m always trying to strategize. I’m like, well, what if this happens?

Okay. Well, like, this is what I’m going to do. Or what if that happens? Well, this is what I’m going to do. And I’m not saying this great y’all can sometimes be exhausting, but I think in your point of how you’re sharing it in a very healthy way, like maybe even putting in like a, a time limit, you know what I mean?

Like just maybe 10 to 20 minutes of thinking of some, of some possible scenarios and then implementing it instead of spiraling. And like, Freaking out. So I just think of myself just from 

Amber: personal experience. And time limit and maybe a space limit. Like maybe you give yourself one page to write out three scenarios.

If this happens, especially if you’re not inclined to do that, it could be an exercise that is more innovative. I love your flip on that. That was good. 

Akua: Yeah, absolutely. And so another question I want to ask you is what systems do you think that independent business owners need to be creating in their business to be successful?

Amber: Oh man. Okay. Number one, we need those revenue generating systems. There are so many, there’s so many, but I’m starting with revenue generating. Because if we can get that in place, sales are absolutely necessary to us building, growing, running our businesses. And to your point, it’s not always going to work, right?

Things are going to come up, things aren’t going to go as planned. So we want something that works, that we can get some peace of mind in. And, alright, we’re going to have to wrap things around that and be strategic at other times. But I want revenue generating systems I put right at the top. The next one, client facing systems.

You get those clients and we want to take care of them, of course, and there are a lot of ways to do that. Time saving systems. If this is taking you forever, if it, oh man, like, ah, we’re redoing steps here a lot. We’re making a lot of mistakes. We’re redoing it. Okay. Let’s, let’s save some time. Let’s save some stress.

Let’s save some energy. So watch for those time saving opportunities. And then my fourth is life giving because we know happy team members. Happy business owners perform better. So if there is something that you are doing and when you do it, it’s like an immediate drain. We want to start to shift that. I don’t want you to spend as much time on it.

At some point, we may want to look to engage a team member, someone else to do that, where it’s their joy and it’s in their zone of genius. But if it is not giving you life, we got like, let’s remix that. And systems are one way to like, okay, that’s a little bit easier. I don’t love it. But a system can.

Accelerate it. And one thing that immediately comes to mind, I love getting great client feedback and reviews, but it is a space I’m like, Oh, you know, I think about it a lot. I get worried. I wonder, I, it’s like, I overthink it and it’s so important. I love the feet. Like it’s necessary and good in so many ways, but that is an area, for example, that is not the process.

is not life giving for me. The outcome is life giving. I wish that was motivation enough. But the process, just woo! So, that is an area where, like, that you could dial in a system. As one example. 

Akua: First of all, I just know, I just want to know what your calendar looks like. Because I just know, it is probably so beautifully organized.

Because the fact that you have it even organized of like, How you even have it categorize all the different types of systems that you need to have in place. That is so organized. And so, um, revenue generating systems, right? Like, I love that so much. Can you give an example or maybe a case study that, um, at the top of your head where, you know, you have seen that just be really successful, even in your own business.

Like, what, Can you break down some of those details in regards to the revenue generating systems? 

Amber: Absolutely. Revenue generating system, you have an ad that goes up to invite people to a photo shoot with you. And then it kicks off from there, right? You go from the, the ad. and the photo shoot to the purchase page.

Okay. Yes. I want this purchase page or we don’t purchase. And what is the followup with that client then? And then they purchase. Okay. Now we’ve got to get their photo shoot booked. We’ve got to follow up with them. We’ve got to follow up after the photo shoot. So that is one very simple example, but it’s a great example because if you have that running well on the front end, That could be 100, 000 in sales for you.

That could be 200, that could be 306, a million, 3 million. So that’s a case study of like, man, get that dialed in and you are good to go. And that’s already very automated. Something that’s simple to automate, but maybe it’s you take a phone call. Okay. What do I say when I’m on that phone call? Um, okay, uh, when’s your, like, and what am I gonna ask?

When’s your wedding? Right? What kind of photos do you want? Right? So you go down. You can have a system for that. So every time you have a prospect call, and you’re like, hmm, what should I say? Document that. Go through it. You’re gonna show up so pro to that client, and your prep is gonna take, you know, like, Not very long because you’ve built a system for that and you’re going to be doing that on repeat.

Then you can also identify opportunities like, oh gosh, that call didn’t go very well. I want to change those questions. Oh, I should have asked this. Dang it. Next time you’ll ask that and the next time and the next time. So they can be very automated and tech oriented or less so, but they’re both systems and they’re both going to help you.

And this is why my calendar isn’t perfect. So organized. And my wife gets a little messy because I got systems to back me up. I feel like I had to confess. Every time you said it, I was like, oh my gosh, I gotta tell her. 

Akua: This is a safe space. So I’m glad that 

Amber: you, thank you all. 

Akua: I’m glad you made sure to share that.

No, I, but I love that though, because to your point, I just think of myself, of even within my systems of really think about the parts that you really hate doing. Like you said, like doesn’t give you I am horrible at emails. I am a voice, no girly through and through. So for me personally, I, I truly was at the time.

That’s why I’m like, I have absolutely lost money because when it’s truly down to even like my emails, I hated responding to them. I would forget I check it. I wouldn’t respond right away, but Oh, yeah, I’d get back to it. And then I would lose it in my inbox. Right. And so for me personally, in my honey book, I love just automating my emails.

But then when that AI email composer came out, I was like, Yes, I mean, it saved me even more time than before. And so I think again, to your point of like, systems are very simple, but then also too, I feel like there’s easily areas that we just don’t think of that we can easily automate. So to your point of just bringing it back down to that, those five, like that, who, what, where, when, why, so then he can really identify those pieces because I’m like, I didn’t even think I’m like, Oh yeah, you can absolutely.

Prep your call. You should be prepping your call, but I also do. How can you have a system in place that where it’s just like, you know, it’s just going boom, boom, boom, boom. And you’re showing up as your best self. Like you feel really good and really confident within that. So I feel like there’s always gaps in our systems that we can always, always improve.

So I love that. And another thing I also wanted to. touch on is that even life giving systems. Let’s talk about that because like I said, like you are a mom, you know, you are a wife, like you have a life outside of your business. So how are you, what kind of systems do you have in place so that you can just enjoy life and enjoy your 

Amber: business?

Oh my gosh, thank you for this question. I have a big accomplishment on this front recently. In January, my husband and I were like, he’s like, this meal plan, this meal dinner situation is not working. I don’t like to cook. I don’t like to plan. I don’t like to think about meals. My favorite meals are the ones that appear and I get to eat it.

Like I will enjoy it, but I’d rather it just appear. And, but my husband, Has been very busy at work, so it has also not been his priority, and so it was in early. February. I said, alright, we gotta change this, we need a whole new system. And a years ago, maybe a decade ago, I had a system where we had week A meals and we had week B meals.

And we didn’t get sick of them because there was enough space in between and they were all our favorites and when we did get sick of something we could rotate. So I adapted a little bit on that this round and I made like 30 post it notes of meals to plan out a whole month. at a time. And so when you plan out the month now, fast forward, we’re in, we’re ending month two and we realized like, okay, that didn’t quite work.

We’re changing out some meals, but we can plan weeks in ahead. So I don’t have to think every week. What do we want to eat? What are the groceries we need? What it was for school. What’s it’s done. And that took me two, maybe two hours. That might even be pushing it two hours on a Saturday in early February.

Fast forward. Now I’m like, I am good. We are so good. And we realized there are things we don’t like. Cause we’re going to look up some new recipes, but man, we are all. So much happier at the time save. We’re eating better, right? I mean, just off the charts impact and it’s simple. It’s a simple thing, but it matters so it 

Akua: matters.

1000%. Absolutely. And I love how you broke that down because decision fatigue is real. Real. 

Amber: It is real. And I don’t 

Akua: think we, we, I don’t think we realize the amount of decisions that we make in a day. Like I experience it so much all the time where I’m like, I don’t have the capacity right now to make this decision.

But when you have systems in place, it removes the decisions you have to make throughout the day. Like even, I sound so lame, but anytime I’m getting ready for a, an interview, I will, I literally purposely do the same makeup look because it’s the last decision I have to make. I love it. I love it. I love it.

I love it. I don’t have, so I do the exact same look every time because I’m like, it’s great. It works perfectly for me. I have everything organized when I’m getting ready so that I know I can get ready in 30 minutes. Like, you know what I mean? Those systems do matter. And then I’m not rushing. I feel really great.

Um, you know what I mean? And I feel confident showing up For these interviews. So I think again, like how can you apply systems to your life and meal prep? Right? Like you already know what you’re going to get, what type of ingredients you’re going to get from the store. You already know how you’re going to cook it.

I mean, and so it makes, again, just driving it back to that. It makes the implementation so much more easier and also enjoyable. Right? Like, you feel good, you’re eating better. And I said this in one of our previous episodes too, where, you know, we link that we, if success to happiness, but it’s actually you need to be happy in order to gain success.

And I just want to drive that again because it’s like, so you have to think too outside of your business of what are the things that are truly going to fill me up? What systems can I also have in place to be able to be able to have healthy, nutritious meals to where I can work out or, you know, whatever it is that you want to do.

Or like, for me, I love pottery. Like, where am I making those? Basis in my life, and so what systems am I implementing to make sure that I can, I can actually do those things. So 

Amber: I love that so much. big fan. I like that makeup routine. Got it. Yes. , this is it. It’s podcast day. Do by the way, your podcast system and workflow and process dialed in.

Yes. That too. Woo. We 

Akua: are, yes, we are so, absolutely, we’re so intentional, right? Because we’re small, but we’re a mighty team. And so we were like, all right, what systems can we have in place? We always check in with each other, like, and I’m like, Hey, I don’t like this. This isn’t working out. Let’s change this up here.

And yeah. Everybody is playing a role and truly, like, the show wouldn’t be what it is today without every single person that knows what they’re doing and is help contributing to the system that makes it very, very successful. So thank you for that.

So when people are creating their systems, what are things that business owners need to consider when they’re creating their systems. What are some key things that they need to be thinking about? 

Amber: Yeah, this is really important. I’m going to go big picture here. Your values. Yes. What is important to you?

And because you want that to pull through in your systems, you also hit on the efficiency. Are we doing things in this process? But that can be iterative. You can, you’ll identify things in a system that you just created. Like, why do we do that? That didn’t work. Back it up, back it up. But also when you design a system, walk through it and be like, are we being as efficient as possible?

Does this align with the why that we talked about? So we’re looking for values alignment. We’re looking for a system that makes sense and aligns with our why. Okay. And think about who it impacts in the end, and what will the result be for them. So this is a client system that’s ultimately for them, impacts them.

You want to match that up to your client experience. For example, if this is a team system, this impacts other people on the team, let’s check with them. Does this make sense for you? Are we bringing you into this process at the right time, or do you want to be involved in this later? So you’re thinking about the other side.

Stakeholders that are involved in the process in addition to efficiencies and your values. 

Akua: Oh, love that so much because values is so, so key. And I think a lot of the times we as business owners, we say that we, you know, we have our values, but one thing that I’m noticing is that we don’t have a fully understanding of how to implement them fully, right?

I think a lot of times we associate it with like, Oh yeah, like in our messaging, right? Like that’s an easy way to showcase your values, but it’s. needs to be intertwined completely in your business, even down to how are we implementing it into your system? What are your values? What are the things that are really important to you?

And, um, we had an episode too, with Lely Amati, who talked about business leadership. And she said to like, she also has her values and, uh, creates these systems in place to prepare her in case something doesn’t even align. So how can she confront things and confront people in a very healthy way? Prep, right?

That preparation. So then if there’s something that doesn’t necessarily align with her, uh, your values, how are you advocating for yourself, prepping yourself for that, creating those systems that it’s like, okay, if yes, and then, or if this is a no, here’s the next step of what I’m going to do. And I think, I think again, it just makes you so much more confident as a business owner, where you feel like you can advocate for yourself, where you feel like.

You know, you’re so grounded in your values and who you are that nothing’s going to shake you and, and, and, you know, how are you leaving that into your system? So that is so, so critical. Yes. 

Amber: You’re spot on. And you are with the values and then how do we bring them to life? Yeah, yes. In our content, but every action, every decision we make, It, we are going to notice and we’re going to be off if it’s not in alignment with our values.

Your team is going to notice, especially if you’re hiring and for people who are values aligned and they’re like, wait, you said family was a core value, but my kids are sick and you’re not being very nice about it. Like, oh, okay. Like that’s going to, people are going to notice this as are your clients.

How do you show up for them when they’re struggling with something or they’re behind like, oh, okay. Okay. Compassion maybe is a core value. So I’m gonna show up in a way that’s aligned with that. That doesn’t mean that we’re, we are sacrificing boundaries or that we are, you know, shifting our beliefs for deliverables, right?

So you still hold to your beliefs, but you operate in a way that is very aligned and consistent and that also has ripple effects. I mean, in the systems, in the team, in the client work, and all these things are so intertwined. 

Akua: Oh, absolutely. And so a follow up question because you said like, too, honoring your boundaries, I think is so important.

And I didn’t even think of that. But yeah, how are you, especially in these types of situations, you know what I mean, how are you honoring your boundaries and not sacrificing those pieces of yourself that are just so important to you? 

Amber: Yeah. You know, this is something I think that you also have to practice and plan and prepare for.

We are good at that. And thinking through this strategy, because. You’re going to be asked things that, oh, no, your body, it’s an immediate no, right? But, oh, sure. Okay. I can figure that out. You’re an entrepreneur. You can figure things out. So if you think through in advance, like, yes, these are my yeses. These are no’s because of my values, because of my pricing strategy, because I can deliver a better product if I do this.

So when you know, again, the why that’s going to help you like, oh, but you got to practice No, and one of my favorites is, oh, no, thank you. And, right, really practicing just, oh, no, thank you. It’s funny, I actually was asked in a meeting, um, a volunteer meeting I was in to do something that was not in my role and I’m happy to, like, do it.

Chip in and step outside of my role. But man, I did not have time. I knew I would not have been able to do that. Well, even if I wanted to, I’m like, Oh man, I got some other projects right now. I’m really not going to be able to take that on. And I simply said, Oh, no, thank you. And everybody looked in the room.

They’re like, cool. Is that it? And I was like, oh, oh, yes, I’m sorry. No, thank you. And just being able, now, if it were a client, if there were other things going on and it made sense for me to explain or add more, I would. And there’s something called the Disney No. Are you familiar with this? No. Okay, this is kind of fun.

Disney is the land of happiness and magic. They make magic. They’re a yes and a happiness company, not a no company. But clearly, we as business owners know, the customer is not always right. And we can’t do everything in alignment with what we want as customers or Say that we need at any given time. And so Disney, the legend is that Disney, uh, doesn’t say no, it’s the Disney.

No. And so you come with a request to go to animal kingdom at 1 a. m. Just after it closed. And they’re like, Ooh, it’s a little short notice for that. You know, if we set up that VIP package earlier, we could probably make that happen. It’s a little short notice tonight. But you know what? Here’s what I can do for you instead.

So in that sentence, you know I’m saying no, but I did not say the word no, because when we put up those boundaries, right, and we hear a no, it is received negative. It’s a negative word, right? No, no, no, no. I don’t want to hear no. So I want to, like, we’re problem solvers. Let’s make things happen. So, instead, you’re proposing an alternative, and this works in scheduling things, it works when your client wants that hair appointment at that exact time, oh, but I’m closed on that day, but I can do the same time for you on Tuesday, would that work for you?

Or if a proposal comes in, you’re like, that’s a really good proposal, but we gotta tweak some things. Hey, you put so much energy and effort into this, I can tell, and I’m really grateful for it. But I’ve got a couple of other ideas I think we can integrate into this. Would you be open to exploring and discussing those?

I didn’t outright say no. I didn’t say like, uh, no, try again. Right. But it’s very collaborative. So I’m honoring boundaries. I’m saying, Oh no, thank you. In and of itself, or if it’s appropriate, I might add a little bit more and move people to a different solution. I love the Disney no. 

Akua: Oh my gosh. Disney no.

Now I’m going to say that. Why do I clap my hands? I’m clapping my hands. Disney no. I’m sorry. Um, but yes, no, but I love that though, right? Like you, number one, because I think obviously to do a lot of a struggle with people pleasing. And sometimes you just don’t owe people an explanation. No, thank you. And keeping it at that, I think is so, so key.

But I love that. Like, You are still presenting another option and a lot of people are, all of us receive that well, right? Like, yes, this is great and here’s the other option that I can provide you, um, to still get you what you want. It’s just going to look a little bit differently than how, uh, you originally thought.

And I think that is just so, so key and such a great, great way to honor yourself. Because you really, now of course, right, if there’s clients and again, To your point, if, if it makes sense, of course. But you really also just don’t owe people an explanation. Like, no thank you suffices. Like, when people say no as a full sentence, no thank you.

And that’s that. And you know, I think I’m, I’m really working on this as myself as an individual. There’s a difference between being nice and kind. And I realized too, like, when I am doing things, I’m, it’s because I want to be nice. I want to be liked and this and that. And it’s like, I would much rather, would prefer to be kind.

Like when I, when people describe Akua, I would write them to say that I’m kind, not nice. And so it’s still honoring my boundaries, putting up boundaries, but doing it in just a very kind way. And it’s just doing it in a way that just, you’re not sacrificing yourself. You’re still honoring yourself. And so, and I’m still working on that.

I mean, I’m still, I’m recovering people, please are still, but, and I still sometimes will over explain myself and I’ll leave a conversation. I’m like, what did I do that? You know what I mean? And so I remind myself like a cool, you can be kind, not nice. Like I prefer kindness over niceness. So anyways, I love that.

There’s so many. key, key things that you shared. So a question that we always end up in the episode with is, what do you think is the biggest differentiator between the businesses that succeed and the ones that fail? 

Amber: Oh, businesses that succeed and the ones that fail. I am going to come back to heart. Uh, there is, I think the businesses that have heart and compassion and soul, certainly we see businesses that are successful that we would say don’t.

Have that, but I think that word success is uniquely defined and man, the businesses that I see that are successful care for people and they care for themselves and they’ve got an eye yes on profit, but not only on profit. So I want to bring it back to heart. 

Akua: Yes, I love that. Right. Um, I just think of, um, a previous episode with Caitlin James, like you have to have a vision and purpose that goes beyond the bottom line.

Of course, we all want to make money. Of course, we all got to eat, but you know what I mean? But the people that we’re serving, like, how are you serving them? How are you showing up for them? How are you leaning in with compassion? Because it’s people that are buying your services. And at the end of the day, we’re all human.

And so like, Really think about just having a heart behind your business. There’s a reason why you have the business that you have. And I think that’s just such a clear reminder because, you know, when you first get started in your business or you have so much passion and you’re, you know, you’re lit up, you’re just on fire.

And sometimes when the reality of the business sets in, it’s hard where you’re like, Oh, you know, when you hit those, those low points, but I think it’s, again, to remember your vision, remember your purpose, remember the heart that you have, because that’s, what’s going to really get you through, especially those mundane pieces, right?

The pieces that are not the most exciting. Um, so I love that so, so much. So yeah, this has been great. Thank you so much, Amber, for this. amazing conversation. And I think it’s just a clear reminder. I mean, you’ve just added a whole nother element to systems and why it’s so important that we need to have it.

And so for people that want to connect further with you, where can they find you? 

Amber: The easiest place to find me is Instagram at Amber McHugh or at my website, Amber McHugh. com. 

Akua: Thank you so much, Amber, for this amazing conversation and for everybody listening until next time, that ends our episode of the independent business podcast.

Everything we’ve discussed today can be found at podcast. honeybook. com. Head to our website to access for show notes, relevant links, and all of the resources that you need to level up. And if you’ve enjoyed today’s episode, be sure to subscribe to the podcast to make sure you never miss our future content.

Drop us a review and leave our guests some love on social. And thank you again for listening.

Akua: Now, there’s only one word to describe today’s episode on the independent business podcast. And that is powerful. Now, if you don’t know who Jasmine Starr is, I guarantee you are going to love her after you listen to this episode. She is a business strategist and CEO of Social Curator, social media marketing company.

And we sat down for an honest and real conversation about entrepreneurship. Jasmine shares with us her business journey from where she started to the major lessons she’s learned and how she deals with imposter syndrome. As business owners, we all experience fear and self doubt and Jasmine reminds us that no matter what obstacle you are facing to keep showing up, do the work and move forward.

This episode was such a gift for me and I know it will be for you too. So let’s get into it. Hey everyone, this is your host Akua Kanadu and you’re listening to the Independent Business Podcast. More people than ever are working for themselves and building profitable businesses in the process. So on this show, I get to sit down with some of the most influential authors, entrepreneurs, and creators to break down the science of self made success so that you can achieve it too.

Hello, Jasmine. How are we doing today? 

Jasmine: I’m doing fantastic. I am very excited for this conversation. 

Akua: Oh, I’m so, so excited to have you here. As I mentioned earlier, I am part of your YBLE course, which has been just so phenomenal. And honestly, just learning more about you through that whole process. I’m like, you really do champion Independent business owners.

So I was like, who better to come on the show and have a real honest conversation about entrepreneurship. And we’re just like, we don’t know where this conversation is going to go. I mean, I want to definitely know like the path that you’ve been on, the lessons that you’ve learned, but I’m excited for you to be here.

So thank you. 

Jasmine: Thank you. You know, when we, when we launched your biggest launch ever, we knew we were attracting a different type of person that’s been in my orbit. Now I am, I’ve the privilege of having a business and speaking and doing podcasts, but the type of person that I get a front row to work with.

We knew when we created this offer was going to be different. And so being able to meet and talk with you, it feels like such an immense moment of gratitude because it’s proof that when you get to work with people who you’re inspired by, you’re like, Oh, it worked. Like the messaging is working and the offer is working.

So us having this conversation, yes, we’re going to serve well, but I just wanted to take a minute and start with an immense moment of gratitude for saying, thank you for allowing me to be part of your journey. And thank you for giving me a front row seat to, as you just build like a massive business. So thank you.

Akua: Well, thank you because I mean, the content is packed. It’s just so helpful. And just seeing the communities that’s being built in it is truly, truly amazing. And so, you know, you have launched, you have launched so many amazing offers, but I want to go back to that. I really want to know who Jasmine Star is, like, where you started, To where you are now.

Jasmine: Yeah, absolutely. And one of the things like right before you push record, you had said that one of the things that you’re good at or interested in is like when you get people to spill the tea. And so it’s like getting people comfortable talking about things that are uncomfortable. I’m like, great, let’s do that in this conversation.

Like, yes, we could start with my origin story. I’m going to give it a little bit short so that we can get into other things that you want to impact this or people. Well, but yes, starting with the foundation is very helpful so that people can understand why I’m so passionate. Or as my mom likes to say, like lovingly stubborn about my point of view.

Um, you know, I dropped out of law school when my mom had a relapse with brain cancer and it really forced me to reconcile what I wanted to do with my life. And so I had a dream of becoming a photographer and I didn’t own a camera. And so I was gifted a camera from my husband. We had just gotten married and I said, I dropped out of law school.

I’ll go back to law school if this thing doesn’t work out. I started my business within the first year and made 100, 000. And I think that some people could hear that and be like, okay, wow, that’s cool. But I think it was a lot cooler for me because I actually wasn’t all that talented. And the fact that I knew that I would be able to create relationships and tell stories and offer a level of service that would allow me to compete in a very competitive space, I realized like, Oh, this is the new way of doing business.

It’s no longer the person with the most talent or the most money. Or the most education who wins? It is the person because right around this time of me starting a business, this is like the onset of the internet. This is the onset of social media. This is the way that people started learning how to sell and consume differently.

And so I was in a position to be at the front edge of that. And I was like, I have nothing to lose. I also have no money. So I’m gonna use this free thing. That’s. You know, call social media and let me see how it works. And so I was able to storytell, I was able to build relationships with clients and then they ended up advocating on my behalf.

And instead of me trying to do the traditional route of building a business, I just turned to my clients and they were the people who started promoting me. And so other people in my space, creative, specifically photographers, videographers, you know, wedding coordinators, they’re like, how are you, how are you doing this?

And I just started teaching people like what I was doing. I was teaching how I was marketing my business. And. That slowly led into me creating digital resources. And so I had this shop and I was selling things for like 2 and 99 cents. And I was like, Oh my God, I’m rich. Like the fact that people wouldn’t spend like five 99.

And then you wake up in the morning and you see notifications. And I’m like, I, I am quite literally making money when I sleep. It was like for, you know, this Brown girl, daughter of an immigrant. It was like, my life had. Totally changed. And so then I started creating additional resources like courses. I then realized that people wanted ongoing community and ongoing education.

And so I created a membership. And then on the back of the membership, I realized that there was like a lot of friction between learning marketing information to applying marketing information. So in 2021, launched a tech stack for social curator where we became a A bonafide SAS offering. So we now integrate with the largest social platforms.

And so, you know, there’s a story of a girl who got a camera from Best Buy and is now a CEO of a tech company. And I get to create podcasts. I get to have conversations. I get to teach other business owners, the art of growing a business. And that brings us here today. 

Akua: Oh my gosh, that is just absolutely amazing just to hear so many pieces of your journey.

And even as I hear yours, I can absolutely relate to certain things as well. Like I am first generation immigrant. My family immigrated from Ghana as well. And you already know where you feel that pressure that you either have to be a doctor, a lawyer, or an engineer like 

Jasmine: that. I will tell you, like folks that come from Nigeria and Ghana, like their kids have, they have, okay.

They have, they have these options. And like, when you’re coming from Mexico, it’s like, You’re going to inherit your father’s like, or you’re going to become like, a, like, I don’t, I don’t know. It was very blue color. Like our options were just like, just pay rent, you know, like you’re going to live with us because Latinos, we all, we all live with each other until we get married or sometimes we just continue living with each other after we get married.

So it was just like, just hold your own. So you had a much higher standard. I will say that I’ll just call it out for what it is. 

Akua: I love that so much. But either way, I think it just gives you such a different perspective. Um, and you move so differently in your business. But one thing that I loved about you was that you said earlier that I didn’t have the most, I wasn’t the most talented, but what you did was that you leaned into the gifts.

You leaned into what you currently had in that season to build the next thing. And then you utilize that to build the next thing. And so something that I’m really curious about to know is, What were some of the struggles that you were experiencing within that? Cause like, it’s not an easy thing to do.

And I think when we hear the stories, we’re like, Oh yeah, like. This is great. But like down to the nitty gritty, like these uncomfortable pieces of that, what was that like for you building these, these offers, you know, especially if things didn’t work out, especially if you, uh, failed, what, like, what was that process like for you?

Jasmine: You know, I think that it seems about, it seems about like in my timing and in my cadence, Every six years, I start shifting and I heard Kobe Bryant describe it the best. And he had said that he got to a point in his career where the game moved slow and it wasn’t that the game got boring and it wasn’t that he got good.

It was that the game moved slow. He understood the game. He could anticipate where the ball was going. He could anticipate where he should stand to get the rebound. He can anticipate if he knew his three pointer or his free throw was going in. He understood it was such a deep complexity that it allowed him to play at a different speed.

And that’s not always a good thing. And so what I realized every six years, somehow the game slows down and I love learning and I love being challenged. And I started realizing that every time that, you know, I tell my origin story and it sounds like I can get it down in 30 seconds, right? I got the sting.

I got the, this and I got that. And I moved here and people were like, Whoa, you did a lot in a short amount of time. And I think that really what it comes back down to is how When you know that there is a different calling on your life, a different level to play the game, it’s going to require you to give up a former sense of your identity and embody something new.

And there’s two main things at play is that you have to give up something in order to gain something else. And there are many times that it, feels like you’re starting from scratch. It feels like you’re at square one. But the thing that I have realized now, looking back at all those times where I wanted to pity myself for starting over or say, it’s really ridiculous that I’m going to be walking away from a very lucrative photography career to start something else is that we look at square one and it’s almost like we have this like tut tut to it.

Like, I don’t need that. Like I am like the English say, I’m going to suck my teeth at it. Like, Oh, and so we look back at these things and I would always look at square one as if square one applied to everybody the same way all the same time. But now I realize that we will never get the same square one again because every journey, every pitfall, every success, every peak and every valley, we’ve learned something and we’ve become a different person.

So even if we go back to square one, we are starting something else entirely. Due to the mistakes we made due to the successes that we had. And so when we start over, the pivot is always the hardest because you have to let go. And the pivot is always the hardest because it feels like you’re now an amateur when you were so used to building your life and career as a professional.

Those are two of the hardest things that I continuously, even in the midst of pivoting myself, you go back to that and you realize, man, This is, this is the stuff that many people don’t talk about and this is the stuff that many people don’t do because it requires us to feel a level of unsafety, a level of unpredictability and a level of sacrifice that if you got used to things looking a very certain way in your life and you want change, it requires change and when it requires change, it requires risk and whenever we risk something, we want to immediately want to like hedge our bets and keep what we have safe, but dwelling in safety doesn’t change.

Allow us to grow and I think that there’s a lot there to be said, but I just want to have that real conversation around what it means right now as we have changed and pivoted. 

Akua: Oh my gosh. Yes. Dwelling in safety does not allow you to grow. I mean, number one, you taking us to church today. I mean, that’s facts because like this is just all that is so key.

And I loved to what you said earlier of you have to let go of something in order to gain something bigger. And do you feel like. As you went into every, like, every six years, and, you know, you’re starting something new, what was that shedding process like for you? You know what I mean? Where, because I feel like, Even if you were going into something that you know is going to be amazing, there’s still grief in what was, if that makes sense.

Jasmine: Oh yeah. I mean, a hundred percent and totally. And I think that I was working with my therapist and she had said that oftentimes it’s really exciting. New things are exciting. Spring is exciting. A new bud is exciting. A Caterpillar emerging from a chrysalis is exciting. We have ideas of the butterfly. And.

There comes a lot of times in our lives and in our careers where we actually don’t take time to express gratitude and a personification of what that journey was. And so she had invited me to look and talk to different versions of my business. And they’re still many of them are still in motion, but I had to speak to them almost like a release.

So, for instance, I am active CEO of Social Curator. We have a team. We have a very thriving community. I love what I do there. I do coaching. We create content. But she said, I need to invite you to express gratitude as if it is no longer there because we need to create space for what is. And so she’s like, you can talk to Social Curator like it’s a person and you could say, Thank you.

Thank you for what you have done. And girl, I have to tell you that thing wrecked me because I didn’t do it in that like, so I just kind of like journaled and I wrote to social curator like she was a real thing. And I was like, you gave us everything. You gave me my house. You gave me my daughter. You’ve given us the best vacations around.

You’ve given me this retirement fund that blows my mind. You’ve given us the chance for this brown girl to learn investing. I now understand what a 401k is. Social curator. Thank you for putting food on my table. Social curator. Thank you for showing my pot, like my family, what’s possible. Thank you. Social curator for changing future legacies.

Like I spoke to her and I was like, at the end of it, I was like, Oh my God. And I’m, and I’m still in it. How beautiful, but it was a way to create emotional distinction of thank you. And more. And I need it just as like, I need to create space for more. And I felt like doing that exercise was so transformative.

And I felt like, Oh, I can love you and I can love this and still find time to create. And I think that that was like the first big step for me to do it. 

Akua: Oh, my gosh. Even hearing you talk about that. I’m not gonna lie to you. My eyes were watering because number one, I think so many business owners, right?

We’re constantly on this hamster wheel and you know, we wear so many multiple hats and we’re just constantly going, going, going. And then once we finally hit what we wanted to hit, we’re looking for the next thing. But to go back and actually look at that journey and especially like you have to let go in order to create more and talk like talking to Social Security as a person.

That is just. Phenomenal. But like, literally, because then you think about it of everything that social security has done for you. And I think of myself right now as I’m in a journey where my capacity is changing with all the change that I’ve experienced, especially in the last six months, seven months.

There are certain parts of me that I’ve had to let go. And a part of me felt guilty of feeling that way of like, I’m so excited for these opportunities that lie ahead, but I miss that. And I know I’m, I’m, I’m currently in my own shedding season and my eyes are, you want to just talk about it because it’s, it’s hard, it’s not easy, but you know, just leaning into that of this opportunity of where I’m at now, exactly.

I’m able to create more of a life that I love to live. I get to be able to connect with so many amazing business owners like yourself who are impacting others and showing up. And it’s truly such a gift. And I think, again, it’s a reminder that our business is a gift and how can we lean into it more? And so I.

Just love that. And so another question I’m really curious about is, you know, I saw this on social media too, which I love that because you had this like fairness framework, which I found so interesting. So as you’re even in, you know, mindset is everything as a business owner and things. There’s so many.

There’s so many disappointments. The things just don’t go our way, especially when we have an expectation in our mind. And you had this framework and for, I literally wrote it down myself. Cause I need to start doing this. Can you just share a little bit about what that is and, and how do you do that in your everyday, especially as you’re in these major seasons of transition?

Jasmine: It’s so funny because I’ve done a lot of work as a person, like in personal development and, um, I, in my family, for better or for worse, we had never even understood what like therapy was. We didn’t understand what like life coaching was. It was just, that was just not even in our orbit or in our sphere.

And so as an adult, I became a business owner and I realized that in order for me, for, in order for my business to grow, in order for me to continue to scale, I needed to scale. I needed to grow. So I started pursuing ways and ventures of self understanding and discovery. And one of those things was being the eldest of five children in a Latino family.

My parents did their absolute best. We did not have money. We didn’t have a lot of, um, we had experiences rich in love, not experiences traditionally that people might look at like a vacation or a trip or a lot of gifts. And so in my mind, subconsciously, I had built this drive for fairness. Things had to be fair in my adult life because things weren’t necessarily fair in my childhood being the eldest I took a lot of responsibility for my siblings and I think that Consciously and subconsciously I shielded them from a lot So that when I became an adult when I graduated college and I got married and I was able to look at my own life I was then able to assess that that is the behavior that I took as my identity and then I started realizing Oh, I want things to be fair when in life You They are anything but that and I started realizing that the older I got and I had the same group of friends since I was 13 years old and as we’ve grown up, a lot of different things have happened to us and that when we look at an event and we say it’s not fair because things hardly ever are, sometimes the unfairness stops many of us.

And it keeps us truncated and stuck in that spot. And some of us have taken an unfair situation and accepted it as part of our story, journey and acclimation to a new level. And so now even further years down the line, I being on the inside as a creator, we have helped more than 40, 000 business owners in their business.

And I started realizing a very distinct pattern is that when something’s not fair, no people don’t normally wake up and say, Today is not fair, but they say, Oh, well, he has that. She has this, he has access to that. She got that. Therefore I can’t. So this, a level of fairness, and if it’s not fair, then they just don’t pursue it anymore.

And I think to myself that the business owners who are actually excelling are the people who are accepting things and regardless if they’re fair or not. And this goes back to the fairness flow chart. I’m going to save the surprise at the end for the fairness flow chart, but let me just start off by saying.

The answer is the same. If it’s fair or not. Or not, our objective is the same if it’s fair or not. And so there is this thing is like whenever something happens to me and have a visceral reaction, I ask myself first and foremost, like, could I control it? Could I control it? And if the answer is yes, I could have controlled it.

Then I moved down, then can I change it? And then I moved down to the final thing. So let’s work this through. Let, let’s just say, was it fair? Was it fair that I didn’t book the client? Well, could I control it? Well, maybe I didn’t respond to emails in time. Maybe I showed up late for a meeting. Maybe I was non communicative.

Well, then can I change it? The answer is yes. As a business owner, you can always find ways to get better. And if I can then change it, then my action is to keep moving forward. Now, there are situations that happen in life and specifically in business that aren’t fair. So I asked myself, is it fair? No. Can I control it?

Well, sometimes I can’t sometimes because of my gender or the color of my skin or the lack of an Ivy league education or the fact that I don’t have an MBA or the fact that I could not get a bank loan. The fact that less than 2 percent of women are getting funding. The fact that less than 0. 6 percent of women of color are getting outside capital for funding or business.

That’s not fair. Can I change it? No. So then what then not do I do? I keep moving forward. If I can control whether or not something is fair or not, doesn’t matter because in either of those situations, if we are to grow in this end, we have to keep moving forward. And I think it’s important for me to assess and just give weight.

Hey, I’m sorry that that wasn’t fair. That really sucks. I’m sorry, but there’s nothing else you do. You keep moving forward. And I think that that was the framework that I had posted out on social media, because that has really helped me a lot. Like it’s okay. Acknowledge it. Acknowledge it. It’s not fair, but guess what?

You have no other option, baby. Keep moving forward. 

Akua: Exactly. Oh my gosh. And that, when I saw that, I was like, I need that. But I just think about that with what you said of there were certain childhood experiences that shaped and molded you and the way that you viewed things in the world. And that totally also leans into how you run your business.

And so I think sometimes we forget of like, We are, we are part of, it’s literally, it’s, it’s one in the same. So what are you doing introspectively? What are you leaning into? How are you healing specific things? Um, doing the work to be able to then run a more successful business. And so that’s what I love about that piece.

And then just the fairness, because I’m exactly the same way, like literally in my mind, I, I’m still working on that where, you know, If something is done in my business that, especially just being a woman of color and the barriers that we face, it leads to having certain types of resentment. And yes, of course I still move forward, but there’s been times where I’m just like, Oh, you know what I mean?

I just get so angry. And it just, that when I saw that framework, it just let, I felt, I just felt like I had permission. You know what I mean? Where it just felt like just be where I could let go. And no matter what the circumstances are, there’s a lot of things in business that we just can’t control. So it’s like, was it fair?

No. It. But acknowledging that and like, okay, that wasn’t fair, but give yourself the gift of honesty. Speak truth over yourself of what the reality of the situation is and utilize that to, to propel you forward to keep going, keep holding your head up high and doing the best that you can. So that’s why I love that framework.

And I’m glad, and I hope that if you’re listening to that, you feel that permission as well. Um, that yes, business is hard and it isn’t fair. There’s going to be aspects where it’s not fair, but then just keep moving forward. I want to actually, we talk about this 

Jasmine: and yes, it sounds good. It sounds warm and.

Buzzy, like it’s not fair. And we’re like, okay, but let’s actually extrapolate kind of like a tertiary, like idea that’s happening here. So oftentimes we as business owners will create content. We create a point of view or we share something we know, and we deal with our best intentions and we put it out and we really hope that it impacts empowers and, you know, Hopefully it’s engaging.

Oh, how we love the likes and the photo of the, the likes, the comments, and the saves. We like that. That dopamine quality makes us feel like we can keep on doing this. And I have to like peel back and say that I shared the fairness framework video and it didn’t do well, well being air quotes in comparison to the other content that I had posted.

But I think it’s really important for us because I had no idea that we would have this podcast conversation around something that I had put out. And it was like, Oh, and you have that temptation of being like, Ooh, that really dragged down the average. You know, it’s like you, you struggle with that. And you’re like, okay, maybe I, maybe I’m not going to be sharing these prayers, like I’m not going to be sharing these learnings because they just not pop in.

I had no idea that it would impact like a person who now, like. Number one is like a rad human being who’s putting out amazing things into the world and speaking up on behalf of people who maybe don’t feel strong enough in their voice. I had no idea that that Baroness framework was going to be empowering somebody who had invested in my business.

I had no idea that we would be sharing a framework now with this audience. And so as we put out content as a reminder to anybody who’s listening, you have no freaking clue what your content is doing, even if it’s one of the worst performing things on your feed, um, in your, um, profile. And so I just wanted to express a little bit of like a moment of gratitude and encouragement for other people who are like, Oh, I’m putting it out and it’s not really going anywhere.

I had no idea. So thank you. 

Akua: Thank you. Yeah, absolutely. And I’m not like looking when I was looking at I was definitely not looking at like, Oh, this was the most like in this and that I just remember going through and of course, all of your content was really valuable. But I remember I just saw that and I was like, I flippin need that.

Jasmine: And I need that today. That’s great. I 

Akua: love that. I love it. But yeah, no, I love that. I think it’s a good reminder that you just again, to your point, you just never know when what people are going to see your continent and what they’re And how people are going to be impacting, impacted by it. But, you know, I want to talk about imposter syndrome because I think that’s something that all of us as business owners, we struggle with, I mean, especially when you’re in new seasons of being uncomfortable and you’re being stretched and pulled in multiple ways.

And I’m just so curious to know with you, um, Especially as you have like listed, we’re so easy to essentially be like, well, I don’t have all of these different types of things and instantly think that we’re not qualified. But I think you’re just such a beautiful testament to that of like, you have leaned in no matter what.

And so I would love to know how you exactly deal with imposter syndrome as you go into these new business ventures, essentially. 

Jasmine: You know, I kind of feel, I don’t, Number one, thank you for asking that question, because I think what you do with people who are listening is that you’re implying that I have somehow like figured it out and I can’t tell if I am completely different.

Um, You’re really dumb or really strong. I don’t know. I, I don’t know. I think that there is a self awareness of me to know that I don’t wake up in the morning and think, Oh, I’m going to go play for the NBA or the WNBA. You know, like, you know what I’m gonna do? I’m gonna go win Wimbledon. I’m not delusional enough so that if something comes in my mind or in my heart, it wouldn’t have been placed there.

If deep down, I didn’t believe that I had the capacity to succeed at that thing. Many people receive a similar message, a similar knowing, a similar desire that what that thing you’re longing to do, like open that Etsy shop or apply to become the CMO or become a content creator or start a podcast. You would not have been given that deep longing and desire.

If you didn’t deep down believe you had the capacity to achieve it. But then here comes the very first hurdle of many is there is a knowing and a longing and adhering to that requires a discipline to fulfill on the work required for you to get the thing that you want in many times, we even lack the discipline or the consistency to do those things.

Now, I am, I am one thing. I am one thing. I am not smart. I’m not fast. I’m not the best. I am not even all that cute. I ain’t got that much written. I’m all, well, I’m Puerto Rican. It’s like a shame, but I know that I can be consistent. And so that alone, that alone gets me over the first hurdle, which is that is like 90 percent of the thing that stops people.

People like, okay, I want to do my Etsy shop. I’m going to do my podcast. And do you know that 90 percent of podcasts ever published in the history of all podcasts, publishing 90 percent do not get past episode 10. 

Akua: Wow, 

Jasmine: so. If you just want to be part of the 10%, just do the 11th episode. And so, you know, that has never been all that much of a struggle.

It’s just like, if I’m going to say I’m going to do it, then I’m just going to do it. And I’m just going to do it and I’m just going to do it. Okay. But then we get into like the, the second realm of like imposter syndrome. And that’s just kind of like, you know, Can I figure it out? Can I figure it out? And I’ve never gone into the game.

Like I have never, I didn’t start a sass company to be like, I’m gonna be the best, most profitable sass to ever exist. I’m a blow everybody’s mind and I’m going to be a 2 billion exiting founder. I didn’t. I just said, I think I could, I think I could figure it out. Or I think I could hire people to help me figure it out.

That’s just been it. And so I think to myself often when imposter syndrome comes up, which it does, why do I belong in this room? Should I be making this investment in my business? Surely they could have asked somebody else to speak. So, um, last month I was reached out by my college and they said, we would like you to give the commencement speech for 2024 graduating class.

And my first thought, which is embarrassing to say, is I turned to my husband and I’m like, They could have found somebody better. And he was like, are you kidding me? I struggle with this as much as anybody else. But in every single one of those situations is, I believe, I deep down believe, I don’t know how many women are going to be giving a commencement speech.

And I don’t know how many of them are going to be a woman of color. And I asked myself, could I figure out how to give a commencement speech? And the answer was yes. Could I figure out how to hire a CTO and build a tech stack? Yes. Could I figure out how to record my podcast in garage band and make it a labor of love?

Yes, still to this day, I am recording in garage band. Your girl’s ghetto is all get out, but I think to myself, I can be consistent and I think I could figure it out and I don’t think that I was given a God sized dream if I didn’t have the capacity to do it. So yes, I struggle, but it’s just those two things.

Can I be consistent? Can I figure it out? And then it will take longer than what you hope. And the results will be different than what you expect. And it’s going to be so much better than you imagine. 

Akua: Oh, yes. So much truth in that. Yes. And also too, I just want to say the fact that you keep saying that you’re not smart, ma’am, you have me shooketh every week.

Okay. So stop, stop playing games. Let’s not play games. Okay. Like 

Jasmine: I do believe, I do believe in the power of words and I do believe that our brain listens to what we say. So what I should say, what I should say, what I should say is I am not the kind of person who’s that, that has that like mass appeal intelligence.

Somebody who can just take a bite out of many things or somebody took a quick learner. What I will say though, what I will say is what I know of the tiny bit that I know of. I feel pretty confident in that. So thank you. I’m kind of reframing that. Like I do. I do know a lot about a little bit. And so in that regard, I feel confident talking about other anything else, anything else.

I’m like, Oh, but in my lip, I do not know. And I do not pretend to know. So yes, thank you for the reframe. 

Akua: I’m just saying when I hear you speak and every time I’m in every time each week of the session, I’m like, did she say what now? I’m like, Oh, Okay. Well, let me, let me start thinking about this differently.

So, um, just want to absolutely highlight that, but I love that so much. I think so many of us, I think of myself when, um, when you said like when you reached out to, you know, literally do a commencement speech at a graduation. I mean, that is huge. And I just remember with my own, I’m going to be pretty transparent here with my own personal conversation with Natalie Frank.

And when she, you know, told me the news and then she had said, you know, Akua, I want you to take over the show. And instantly I first thought in my mind. I literally said to her, I said, absolutely not. It’s like, that was my first thing. I said, you are in, like, no, I’m not doing this, miss ma’am. And, you know, and she was like, okay, cool, like, that’s fine, but think about it.

But it was similar to those things that you had said, you know, and it was just so Like, Akua, you can figure this out, number one, and she was having her season of being bold and gutsy, and I was like, I gotta be gutsy too. Like, I can figure this out. I can do it. I have the support. There are people, you know, there’s amazing supportive people at HoneyBook who are here.

Like, I can do this. And so, I just leaned into it, and it has been like, it’s been so uncomfortable, so many moments, but I am learning so much. So much about myself about who I am as a person, who I am as a business owner, the person I want to become the business owner I want to be and how I want to show up in a lot of these spaces.

And so just to even say like, they’re so, if you’re listening, so I know so many of us are, can all relate to that capacity where like there’s an opportunity or something comes up and we can instantly automatically be like, huh. Me, you know what I mean? And so just similar to you, I’m like, Oh my gosh, I’m reminding myself to have like, I can do hard things.

I’m capable. I can figure it out. And so, yes, I love that. So, but 

Jasmine: add to that you are consistent. How many shows did you work with alongside Natalie and stay consistent to prove yourself? We stack proof. Our actions just stack proof. Is that like somebody’s like, Oh, I want to run a marathon. You don’t wake up the next day and you run a marathon.

What do you do? You stack proof. It’s like one day you run for five minutes and you do that for five days and the next day you run. I mean the next day six, you run six minutes and you do that for another five days and then day 15 you’re out there running seven minutes. You’re just stacking proof. And I think that’s what you did.

So two main things for imposter syndrome would be the things that you did. Can I stack proof? Can it be consistent? And can I figure it out? And you did. 

Akua: Yes. Oh, I know. And that’s, that’s, it’s fact. And I know, I love how you just, it’s, it’s simple. It’s simple when you hear it. It’s, we all know it’s so much harder to implement, but then when you’re actually talking about it, you’re like, can you figure it out?

Yes or no? It’s like almost right. Like putting it in a framework. Can you figure it out? Yes or no? Yes. Okay. Then what’s the next step, right? Like that helps you move on to where like, okay. Yes. Like where you can empower yourself to move forward. I love that. And so a question I’m really curious about for you is.

What is next for Jasmine? Like, as you were, you know, number one, you’re giving a speech at a, at your college, which is amazing. I’m excited to hear about that, but also, you know, I’m gonna take my girl. Everything’s content. I’m taking my 

Jasmine: videographer. I was like, I’m not even recording. I was like, I’m gonna take it so I could share it.

Like, you know, it’s just like, how many people are going to be in a stadium at that time? But how many followers do I have? Or how many times can I share the things that I have? And I feel like I feel like I want that pressure on myself because I don’t feel like you ever give a commencement speech. to the people who are sitting in the audience, you give it to other people who need to hear that message as well.

So, yeah. Sorry. 

Akua: No, no, no. I’m excited. I can’t wait to see you in your gown and cap. Because it gave me one of those. I’m pretty sure. I’m like, okay, okay. I know. I know. I’m excited. But I’m really curious to know, like, what is next for you? You know, and especially, how do you continue to lean in with whatever it is that you’re doing?

And, What are you excited about? What are you nervous about? I’m so curious to know. 

Jasmine: Uh, I had a conversation with my mentor and she was on my podcast and she had said something that has kind of been like a defining thing for the me the past year. And she had said that you earn the right to solve bigger problems because there’s like the story in entrepreneurship that we’re saying, well, when we get to this place, When we get to that spot, it’ll be easier or more manageable.

And that was like a common misnomer and you know, I’m very fortunate that the business has continued to grow year year over year. And whenever I said, okay, well it’s just when I make 100, 000, well it’s just when I make 100, 000 in a month, it’s just when I make a million dollars, well it’s just when I make a million dollars in a month, it’s just when I make a million dollars in a day.

And so it’s always this moving line that never became capital E. Enough. And so I think that my big move this year is to really embrace the bigger problems I get to help solve for people, the more money the business makes. And so this whole year has been a year of exploration is how might we solve bigger problems?

And one thing that I distinctly realized in 2022 was I’m the kind of person who, uh, I love to solve things. I love to be like, I’m a get her done kind of girl. Like, let’s just go, go, go. And, uh, you, a separate entity can only get to a certain point on your own in anything. Positive, amazing, powerful, transformative has been on the back of the Team that we have built.

And so for me, it is a whole, like, in fact, just this morning, I went on a walk and oftentimes I get my clearest thoughts when I’m exercising, because I don’t listen to anything. I don’t do anything. I’m just in the zone. And so I had sent a voice memo to our COO. And I said, I just want to say that as a CEO, many times we function in two zones, reactive or responsive.

At our most healthy where our, our majority is responsive. I’m responding to things, initiatives, visions, reactive is it’s emotional. I need to give a quick response and I’m going to send you a message today that is fully responsive so that if ever in the future, it’s reactive, you know, the true root of it.

Undistilled undiluted. And I said, I love the structure of the business that we have today. And I want to keep this structure. I want to keep this structure and I want to double and double and double and double what we’re doing in this business. So this is me being fully responsive. And then I listed everything I currently love.

I am no longer in meetings that I don’t need to be there to be like a hype up girl. I have two standing meetings a week. I have large swaths of work days. Yesterday was a work day where I get to only do things that only I can do in the business. If somebody else in the business can do it. I need to not be doing it.

I need to get out of the weeds. I need to co create with a powerhouse team and I can do the thing that only I can do in my business. I only want to do only things that I can do in any time. So one of the questions that we had, we had a conversation with in the podcast channel on slack and they were talking about finding the right type of editor.

So we had three different editors work on it and I was listening to the nuances and they wanted my feedback and I said, I love that. I was asked about the feedback. Okay. But let me tell you, I trust our podcast producer and let me tell you that even though our COO came back to us, she’s like, yeah, but she had an opinion and you had a different opinion.

I was like, but let me just tell you at the end of the day, yes, I preferred somebody else for X, Y, and Z, but it wasn’t 10 X greater. I was listening to nuances that the average listener is not going to listen to. So the fact of whatever time it took me for me to be in there, to look at pop mics, to figure out the kind of acoustics, I’m like that 30 minutes was worth the dollar amount that served the business much better than.

What we did in the podcast and she’s like I hear it loud and clear and I was like that felt so good So where am I at right now? I’m asking myself How might we solve bigger? Problems and I think it’s been a very interesting Conversation because the minute you start asking these questions your mind starts opening up to pathways that probably had other people Always been there and you never allowed yourself to see them.

It is the same thing as like, Oh, if you get a new car and it’s like a red, whatever, a red BMW, all of a sudden you start seeing red BMWs. They were always there. They were always there, but you just see them differently now. So all of a sudden we start asking, like, I wonder if we could. And then all of a sudden, out of nowhere, these conversations that I’m having, I’m like, Oh, it’s always been there.

And so right now it’s just a year of deep exploration. And I told the team, I was like, so how little can we pull on making an ask of the audience? How little can, how much can we over serve and ask for a little? And so that’s where we’re at right now. Like, how do I solve, because the bigger, the problems that I solve for people who could really afford it, the more I’m empowered to create, create, create, create to the people who need it the most and can’t afford it.

And so that’s been our big focus this year. 

Akua: Oh my gosh, I love that so, so much and just how you are leaning more into exploring and just creating that space for yourself so that you can become more innovative. And I think innovation is key because you know, the landscape of entrepreneurship, it’s just changed.

It’s changed so much over the years. Like what just even just from four years ago, like after the pandemic, I feel like everything has just shifted. And how, and the way that we do business. completely has changed. And innovation is one of the best ways to help you stay on top of things, but also to where you can do the things that really truly bring you joy and that are really going to serve your audience and serve them well.

And so, oh my gosh, Jasmine, I could talk to you for hours and I’m like, oh my gosh, 

Jasmine: can I add, can I add just one time? I need to make sure there’s a moment of clarity because then when you’re like, I love how you add so much time and space for creativity and innovation. And I’m like, That is true, but it is not 100 percent of the truth.

And I want to make sure that I’m sharing 100 percent of the truth because I don’t want somebody listening to it and being like, must be nice. What Akua said was true. I am creating space. I am allowing for innovation. I’m in a zone of creativity, but please know it comes at a cost. And the cost for me right now is coming in time.

Every minute of my day is truly scheduled. And I even have to plan ideate for X set up meeting for Y build out team structure for whatever. And also At money, we were cutting off revenue streams because they were requiring me to be the driving force behind it and not the team. So please understand that.

Yeah, it’s a beautiful zone. It’s also a very precarious zone and we live and die by the sword so that we, you know, we cut down the crops that we think are going to impede on what we hope to be a much larger harvest in the future. So that’s, that’s the 100. 

Akua: Well, thank you for saying that because I, a question I was going to ask literally for you is kind of so much of how you are creating that space, because I feel like as, especially with solopreneurs, like it’s so difficult where it’s like, even for me at times, like I said, my capacity has changed and I’ve been like, Oh my gosh, like I want to be innovative.

I want to create that space, um, where I can, you know, think of something new and this and that and that, but I’m so exhausted and like X, Y, Z. So I love that you shared that because I’m like, Yeah, it’s gonna come at a cost. I didn’t even think of that. I literally did not think in my mind that that could like what you have to give up in order to be able to create those spaces, but you need to create.

I feel like it’s important to create those spaces because that’s how your business is essentially going to evolve and it’s and take you into a journey that you would never think of. I never ever in my life wanted to be a storyteller. I never thought that I never even thought that my business was gonna be, you know, but it was just like, yeah, I literally kept having those spaces to be creative.

I just remember like in the beginning journey in our business, when you have much more of that space, but as things continue to evolve and scale and grow, the amount of time just becomes so much more limited and it’s just so much more difficult. And then like personally at times where I have felt stagnant in my business and I’m like, I just don’t have that space to create and it’s such a hard hump to get over.

And so I’m glad that you were just overall just transparent of like, I am creating the space, but also to like, let’s look at the facts here of like what you also have to give up. So absolutely love that so much. And Jasmine, this, this whole conversation has just been so, so impactful. I mean, I could talk to you for hours.

This is the first time we’re 

Jasmine: meeting and I’m like, Oh my God, like if you left us alone in a coffee shop, we’d open and close it down. And then be like, this time tomorrow, 

Akua: with snacks, get me some good snacks. I will never leave. Exactly. And chatting about all things about life and business. And no, truly, this has been a life, life giving conversation.

And I think if you’re listening, cause I have felt it too. I’ve just, I feel just a certain amount of, um, permission in certain areas of letting go and, and you know, what. Really thinking about again, what kind of business owner do I want to be? And, and in this new season of life. And so a question that we love to end with for every episode is what do you think is the biggest differentiator between the businesses that succeed and the ones that fail?

Jasmine: Consistency. It is literally everything you want is on the other side of consistency. And it is so simple, but it is not easy. 

Akua: But now I’m going to add to that because we hear consistency all the time. And I’ve also also heard you got to be consistent with what looks like for you and all those different types of things.

How do you stay consistent? 

Jasmine: You plan for it. And I want to be very clear that consistency is not doing the same thing again and again. That’s the exact definition of insanity. Einstein said, Insanity is doing the same thing again and again and expecting a different result. All I’m saying in regards to consistency is just decide to show up and do something.

Because it is the something that will lead to a slightly different iteration the next day and a slightly different iteration the next day. So it’s always a constant evolution, but you have to just first make the commitment to do something every day. And what we want to do is we want to quantify, well, if it’s only a 10 minute thing, did I really do it?

So is it really worth it? The answer is always yes. It is better for you to put your head down at the end of the day and say, instead of watching that one extra episode of Netflix, instead of sitting around scrolling for 10 minutes, I should have been engaging. It is that one. an act of consistency that truly defines those who succeed and those who do not.

And I know I sound pretty hard nosed about it and I’m bullish. I am bullish around making a decision because here’s the thing. They, the people say, Oh, it’s so easy for people to be consistent if they’re disciplined. And I’m like, no, we’re all disciplined. We just decide to apply our discipline in different ways.

It is very, it takes somebody very disciplined to watch an entire season on Netflix. That’s discipline. 

Akua: So true. That’s 

Jasmine: discipline. It’s a lot of discipline for somebody to eat a whole pizza instead of three or four slices. That’s discipline. It’s just as disciplined for you to say, I’m not going to watch Netflix.

And instead I’m going to go through and plan my content for the next month, the next week. I’m going to find my content for the next day, depending on how much time you have. We’re all disciplined. Where are you applying your discipline in order for you to get the benefits of consistency? My mind is blown.

Because 

Akua: that is so true. I have never, ever, ever thought about it that way. It is so true. It is absolutely, it’s a different, it’s a, where are you applying the discipline? I have absolutely shamelessly watched so many episodes of Grey’s Anatomy recently. You sound like my sister in law. It caught me and I was like, here I am again.

And you know, halfway through season one in a day, you know what I mean? Where I was like, oh. I have work to do. I have work to do. And that’s so true. And I think, again, it just makes me think about number two things. My therapist reminded us, she’s like, choose your heart. Everything in life is hard and it’s just a different type.

Choose your heart, right? Like if you’re watching and this is not to guilt anybody, cause I, like I said, I just did it the other day now, but you know, if you’re out here watching or doing something where you know that your time is best spent, you’re going to have a harder time, right? Like I always think to myself now, like, okay, if I don’t do this now, what’s going to happen?

Like, I’m going to have a harder time doing this or that. So I’m like, just get it done now. Choose your heart. Right. And so I remember I saw this, uh, social media posts. I’m like, what consistency looks like? And it was like all of these, uh, illustrations and it had like, like a bottle, like, right. Like one day maybe you could give just, you know, 10 percent or the next day you can give 50 or then the next day you can give a hundred and then, or 20%.

And it’s like, I think to your point of just like, still just showing up to do something that’s going to move the needle forward in your business. So I love that so much. And Jasmine, thank you. Thank you so much for being on the show today and for people that wanna connect with you, where can they find you?

Jasmine: Well, I have to say that this conversation has been very McDreamy. You can find [email protected] or on my podcast, the Jasmine Star Show, . 

Akua: Oh my gosh. Uh, this conversation has been so much fun. Thank you. Thank you so much for being here and for everybody listening until next time.

Akua Konadu: One year ago this week, we launched the Independent Business Podcast. And what better way to celebrate than by doing our very first episode roundup. Now, you know, every episode we end with the question, what’s the biggest differentiator between the businesses that succeed and the ones that fail? Well, we gathered some of our amazing answers by some of the incredible guests who have been on the show.

Their responses are going to leave you empowered and inspired. We’ve shared a soundbite from each episode along with the name of the guest and the episode number so you can go back and listen to the full conversation. Not only that, all of the original episodes will be linked in the show notes. Now, this is a huge milestone and we are just so excited that you have been here with us through this incredible journey.

If you enjoyed this episode, make sure to subscribe on your favorite podcast player. Now let’s get into the episode. Hey everyone. This is your host Akua Konadu and you’re listening to the independent business podcast. More people than ever are working for themselves and building profitable businesses in the process.

So on this show, I get to sit down with some of the most influential authors, entrepreneurs, and creators to break down the science of self made success so that you can achieve it too.

Our first tip is from episode 32 with Instagram growth coach, Brock Johnson and his episode. We talk about his learnings from losing 14, 000 followers in one week and his take on business success. It’s not as complicated as you think. Let’s check it out. 

Brock: The difference between the business owners who are successful and the ones who aren’t ultimately, it comes down to consistency on Instagram, on social media, consistently showing up.

It also comes down to not overthinking it. Like stop trying to make perfect content. Stop overthinking everything you post. Is this good enough? Most people aren’t even paying attention to you anyway. Well, I have this one hair out of place. Well, this filter isn’t right. Well, I made a typo here. Who cares?

No, one’s going to notice the vast majority of your followers. Ain’t paying that much attention to you. They’re too busy worried about themselves and their own mistakes and their own imperfections. So the creators, the business owners who are successful are the ones who first They’re willing to bet on themselves.

They’re willing to rip off the bandaid. They’re willing to make the jump, take the leap, whatever cliche expression you want to use here, they just get started. Like they, they stop overthinking it. They have the superpower of under thinking it and just taking action. And then once they take that action, they just keep doing it.

They keep showing up, they keep hammering, they keep putting in the work day after day, and. They learn as they go, they have that 1 percent improvement. They’re constantly making little tweaks along the way. Like there’s all those little things that will add up over time. Sure. But ultimately like 95 percent of people will fail because they just stay consistent.

They just give up. They, they get dejected because of bad results or whatever. And so they just give up when ultimately the ones who are successful and seem like they’re overnight results and seem like they’re overnight successes. They don’t. You look back and those are the people who have actually been consistent for like last 14 years.

The person who’s like writing the book about their a hundred million dollar business. They’re actually, they’ve been doing this for like 20 years. They didn’t just have like one viral TikTok. They’ve been doing this. They’ve been putting in the work. They were willing to bet on themselves and ultimately they were willing to just get started.

Akua Konadu: Tip number two is from episode 46 with Denyte Bearhay, who is a messaging and positioning strategist. And we talk about how to create an empathy forward sales strategy in your business. And her hot tip, to remember that you are the secret sauce to your business. I think 

Danait: it’s really being able to carve your own path and seeing that everything else is a tool.

If you can see everything else, social media, chat GPT, strategies and tactics and hacks as tools to enhance your business. What you do and how you do it, then that mindset is everything in business because you will be the person who’s going to be okay if like the internet shuts down tomorrow and you’re going to go, you’re going to be able to be the person who’s going to go, Put a stand outside your house and be like, Hey, this is what I do.

This is how I help people. And you’re going to, you’re going to find a way to make things happen. And I think that’s just like, I think entrepreneurs are just naturally like that. We have that grit, that ability to be scrappy and to figure things out. And so if you can lean on that more than you lean on all the tools that are available to us.

That is what will continue to, those are the businesses that I see continue to succeed regardless of what’s going on in the world. And the ones that kind of fall to the wayside, because unfortunately they’ve relied so heavily and think that the tools are the key to the success when in reality, you are the key to the success.

It’s you and you, what you’re bringing to the table and what you’re bringing to the world. And I think when you can really tap into that, like, You become unstoppable as an entrepreneur. And I think there’s nothing more magical than that. 

Akua Konadu: All right. So tip number three, we pulled from episode 20 with wedding photographer, Caitlin James.

She sat down with us to give us the inside scoop on what it really takes to make 250, 000 a month in her business. She reminds us that in order to have a successful business, you need to have a vision and purpose that goes beyond the bottom line. 

Kaitlyn: I think the businesses that succeed in, from my perspective, I think they have vision.

Beyond the bottom line, I think they have purpose and maybe statistically this would prove me wrong, right? Cause there’s always people that can have a business with no heart and people are, you know, duped into buying from something that they don’t really believe in and I’m sure there’s exceptions, but that also goes back to, well, what is success because Success for me, someone said recently, um, we buy raw milk from farm out in Lexington, um, Creambrook farms.

And we were actually with the owner the other day and we were talking about business and he’s like, it seems like everybody just, when did business become about acquisition? He’s like, when did that become a thing? You build a business just to get it sold and make a lot of money. He’s like, I thought you built a business to serve your family and to serve your life and to do something you’re passionate about, make money doing it.

And I’m like, You’re right. You are so right. And so if that is success, then it does have to be rooted in purpose and how you’re changing people’s lives, which is all rooted in the vision of it. So maybe I am right. Maybe this is, maybe this is what I truly believe. I do think that it has, you have to have a vision that goes beyond yourself.

And if that is true, then. People attach on to that and sometimes I think people attach on to that before they even know why they’re attracted to you. We’ve had people say this before they will say things like I found you on YouTube and I don’t know why but I just keep watching all your stuff and then they’ll see one video or hear me explain one thing and they’re like I Resonate with you.

Thank you for caring about what you’re doing. And I do I think that is At the heart of a business owner, I think ultimately it’s when their purpose aligns with their passion, which is what I aim to do with the rest of my business running years. 

Akua Konadu: Tip number four, we grabbed from episode 39 with the owner of Currently Events, Christiana Yibra.

We learned in her episode, the systems and strategies she implemented that led to her side hustle generating half a million dollars in revenue and her key takeaway, being prepared is essential to business success. 

Christiana: I think it’s that preparedness. We’ve talked a lot about that. Um, I think, you know, I, I love listening to podcasts that give real tangible, true advice for someone who’s listening right now to actually implement.

And if anybody can advocate for the power of having a side hustle drive, some financial freedom for them, I feel really confident that I can actually Probably years ago, I don’t know if I would have been able to stand on a metaphorical stage or a platform and tell people, but I think one thing that I’d love to share with people is that no matter what your full time role is, if you have a passion that’s elsewhere, being prepared and researched and thoughtful about how to bring those passions to life is It’s not a, it’s not a pipe dream.

It’s not something that’s so far away that you can’t attain it. The photo booth for me, again, not the most groundbreaking work I’ve ever done, but it is something I love. I’m so proud of and having the, the preparedness now, now to start wasn’t so prepared. So having infrastructure like what HoneyBook offered me, um, allowed me to really, Focus my full time efforts on my W2 role, but man, I felt really good when those inquiries came in and I wasn’t worried about who was going to respond to them or how we were going to get the contracts out to them fast.

That gave me a peace of mind to just get ultra creative and lean all the way in. And without it, I would not be able to have afforded, um, some of the incredible things I’ve been able to do the last several years, having that side hustle, but be a full time passion is something I think that there’s a lot of people who are trying to figure out how they make that next move.

If you have the. It’s less about the money that you have and it’s more about how prepared you can be and how willing you are to dig deep. The one thing I’ll say to people is that there’s a lot of research out there and people have shared their stories about what works and what works well. So listening to podcasts like this, like if you’re thinking, Hmm, I gotta figure out what my next move is, you’re already a step ahead.

Of a very large amount of people who are in the similar step, listening and learning and seeking out these resources, um, are what’s going to differentiate you and the others. So I’m, I’m proud to be able to say that finally. And, um, I’ve loved to be able to share more with the creatives that we work with here in Dallas and, um, and beyond.

So platforms like this, give me a reach beyond what my photo booths can do just here in the DFW area. And I know that our impact is, is there as well. 

Akua Konadu: Tip number five is from episode 31 with Jen Olmsted, the CEO of Tonic Sightshop. We did a really fun case study breaking down how Starbucks turned the pumpkin spice latte into a major lifestyle brand that we all know and love.

She shares with us that the most successful businesses are the ones that are able 

Jenn: to pivot. I think the number one thing that I see and that I’ve experienced is the biggest differentiator, but that between brands that succeed and brands that fail is the ability to pivot the ability to learn and grow and to make different decisions over time.

And so Starbucks is a great example of us. They saw something that was working. They said, okay, let’s lean into this. Every year we’re going to find out a new way to do it and do it better. And one of the reasons that we at Tonic exist is because we say that you guys need a website that moves as fast as you do, because in this economy, nothing is a guarantee anymore, right?

There are certain things that used to be a guarantee. Facebook ads, great example, felt like you were printing money with Facebook ads a few years ago. No longer the case. Apple changed a few things. That’s gone. Instagram, right? We were like. Instagram sure thing I can send a photo to all my friends.

They’re gonna see it like Jokes on us. No, like we’ve all got to create video content now. So when you can figure out as a brand, what do I need to do to still reach my people? No matter the medium that I’m experiencing, no matter the kind of content that I have to create that ability to pivot, I think is absolutely everything as a brand and it requires listening to your audience.

Knowing who you are in your marketplace and then being willing to shift when it’s working and when it’s not working over and over again. 

Akua Konadu: Tip number six comes from episode 27 with Emmy award winning designer and CEO of The Future, Chris Do. In his episode, we explored how to determine your rates, select the right clients to work with, and cultivate community.

He gives us so many gems in this next clip and it will leave you absolutely speechless. Let’s take a look. 

Christiana: Number one, I think is focus. Businesses fail because they’re not focused. They are, they have a case of the shiny object syndrome. And like, squirrel, okay, that’s cool. I’ll do this and I’ll do that.

And they lose track of their core business. And this happens especially in this age when we have so much distraction available to us and the next big idea seems better than the current idea. What we need to do is we need to figure out what we want to do. And we need to commit. And this will be my third and last reference to Seth Godin.

In his book, The Dip, he talks about this and there’s a little graph, right? So when you start out, you get results right away and it’s really fun and exciting. So the results are high, the effort and time is limited. But what happens is it starts to hit a peak and you go into the trough of this curve.

You’re entering the dip where, you know what, I was messing around with tennis, but now it’s like, it’s a chore. I don’t want to learn how to serve. My backhand sucks. And my foot placement is all wrong. And it’s like, it’s just too much work. And I’m not seeing the same kind of progress in fun. So what people do is they quit.

They quit in the dip because it’s a lot of work. It’s a lot of time and they’re not seeing that same return on investment of time. But here’s the thing, this is what Seth talks about. So in the dip, you have to have the courage and the commitment, the determination to get through it, because it’s difficult to get through.

And then you put in your thousand hours or ten thousand hours of practice. You hire a coach. You go to workshops. You read books. You watch videos. You train up. You level up. You skill up. And you start to climb that steep ascent and it starts to get good again until you get to this very rare place where only a few people exist.

The masters, the experts, the thought leaders. So instead of looking at the dip as your enemy, look at it as your friend because difficulty creates natural barriers to competition and it creates scarcity. If only a few people can become a doctor, if only a few people can be a brand designer for global companies in the fortune 100, that creates value because you’ve reduced the competition by just going through the dip.

So maybe there’s a couple things on pack here. You need to focus and commit, you have to put in the work, you have to find joy in the difficult, because if you don’t, it’s going to be really hard to get through it. And the last thing I’ll say is, and I put this on a tweet recently, you have to be kind to yourself when you fail, because every journey is full of failures, and what happens is we hear the voice, Of whoever’s most influential in our lives, oftentimes one of our parents, when we mess up, when we lose a job, when we totally eff it up and clients yell at us, we’re like, Oh, we’re on it, we’re in our mind, just destroying ourselves.

And the thing is, you’re going to need that resilience to bounce back up and to wake up tomorrow, full of determination and say, you know what, instead of just dogging myself on this, I’m going to ask myself this question. What was the learning opportunity here? What was the teachable moment? The thing that the universe sent to me to learn and knew that I had the strength to get through.

Cause if I don’t learn that lesson, this will be all in Maine and I’m almost destined to do this again. And I’ve had many failures in my life. Code them in my mind as failures. I just look at them as learning opportunities. Sometimes they’re very expensive learning opportunities and I want to grow because I don’t like making the same mistake and failing again.

Akua Konadu: Tip number seven comes from episode 44 with the CEO of Elevate Visuals, Shay Cochran. She pulls back the curtain to show us how she was able to build multiple six figure businesses while only working 16 hours a week. She keeps it short and sweet with this tip that the key is discipline to business success.

Shay: Discipline. Easy. I have a quick answer to that one. It’s not the funnest word, but it, listen, it’s not your marketing strategy. It’s not your product. It’s not even whether your product is that good or the best. It’s, it’s discipline. It’s disciplined thought. Discipline in your thought process, which is what we’ve talked about.

It’s disciplined focus. So here’s what I can be good at. Here’s what’s working. Here’s where I can win. I’m gonna, here’s the platform I can win on. Like it’s, it’s disciplined focus. And then it’s disciplined action. It’s an, it’s one thing to know what you need to do. But we all know as an entrepreneur, it’s a whole nother thing to sit down at your desk and actually do it.

Actually do the thing that’s the most important in your day. And not email. And not the other things. You know, to actually do it. So discipline, discipline, discipline. I think it’s the disciplined people who win as entrepreneurs. Disciplined people. Thought disciplined, focused, disciplined action. 

Akua Konadu: All right.

Tip number eight, we pulled from episode 14 with Maddie James, who is a best selling author and a lifestyle expert and her episode, she encourages all independent business owners to embrace your own magic, her tip to running a successful business, don’t give up. 

Mattie: Anybody can give up. Anybody can give up, but the people who say, okay, you know, I might’ve, I might’ve missed the mark here, but I’m going to still show up.

I’m gonna show up even though I looked stupid in front of some people last month when, you know, my email went out and I didn’t actually put in the names of people and it just said, you know, first name. I’m gonna show up even though packages showed up to people’s houses late and I told them that they were gonna get their product this time.

I’m gonna show up even though I didn’t get selected in this list that I wanted to be a part of. I’m gonna show up. You just have to keep on showing up. Again, there are so many reasons why you shouldn’t, but the people who keep on going, they are the people who win. They are the people who win and I mean and you can see this in so many different examples in music in sports In movies certainly in business, but in life the people who keep showing up not only for themselves But they show up because they know that they’re gifting their light Their magic is to give other people permission to show up in their gifting their light and their magic as well That is what will never fail You That is what we’ll never lose because when you start to show up at a service for others and not just to please yourself, it’s really impossible to win and I really truly believe that the brands and the companies and businesses who decide to do that, they are the ones who break through the noise and make a real difference.

Akua Konadu: Tip number nine is from episode 35 with photographer Hope Taylor, and we dive into what she learned from building a multi six figure passive income streams. And what is Hope’s tip? Don’t be afraid to try things again. I feel like 

Hope: in the vein of what we’ve talked a lot about, about like not being scared to start something new and about kind of using your failures just to learn and treating new things as an experiment and just helping, letting that content help you to move forward and figure out what you need to know about your audience.

I think one of the biggest things, especially in this passive space that differentiates people is your ability to change with the times and try things again at a new angle if they don’t work the way you thought the first time. Because one of the things I see so often in like my mastermind students who are incredible that they’re in that high level coaching program where I work really closely with them is that they put so much work into a first launch.

Like when you’re creating a product for the first time, it’s a lot of work, right? Like, it’s hard. baby, but it’s our pride and joy, right? Like we’re putting this thing into the world and if it doesn’t go exactly how we thought it was going to go, it can be really easy to feel really defeated by that because we’ve put a hundred percent of our heart and soul into this product and it would be really easy to then just put that product on a shelf and never talk about it again and kind of have your tail tucked between your legs.

Like what I talked about earlier with my first course launch. And I think the differentiator is the people that are willing to look at that in every way. Analyze it and be strategic about it and then do it again. And that’s just, I hate how like fluffy and like typical that sounds of like, just get back up and keep trying.

But I actually am somebody that has anxiety and like really struggle with this sometimes of like, okay, but what, you know, this could go wrong could go wrong and people could hate it and people could say mean things on the internet and here’s the hundred negative things that could come out of me trying this again and my therapist actually says this to me, her name’s Maria, shout out Maria, we love her, but she always says if I, if I say I’m anxious about something or come up with, you know, a reason that I’m stressed, she always says, okay, Let’s actually discuss the worst possible case scenario, right?

Because our brain will create 17 worst possible case scenarios and then we’ll just spiral and be stressed and not try again or, or, you know, fear of failure. But if we actually analyze the worst case scenario, like, okay, if I launch this product that I’ve worked really hard on and I don’t make as much money as I thought, what’s gonna happen?

I’m going to be a little sad, right? Somebody could say something mean on the internet. Then what? I’m going to delete their comment. Then what? I’m going to block them. Then what? I’m never going to think about it again and I’m just going to do it again. The worst possible case scenarios are never as bad as we make them seem in our brain.

And I think that that kind of mindset shift and piece of advice has really helped me to look at it like you said. Like an experiment. Try it. See what happens. Analyze it and try again because the worst possible case scenario is never as bad as our brain tries to tell us it’s going to be. 

Akua Konadu: Tip number 10 comes from episode one with Ellen Yin, the founder and podcast host of Cubicle to CEO.

In her episode, Ellen takes us through her journey of quitting her corporate job without a backup plan and turning a 300 freelancing contract as a marketing consultant into a seven figure business. Ellen shares a powerful reminder of how understanding your data will lead to business success. 

Ellen: It is an affinity for failure, a love for it, actually, the desire to fail as often as possible, because like, like we talked about today, Nat, data drives everything, right?

And you cannot, you truly cannot become the person you want to be or grow the business you want to have if you fail. Are basing everything, filtering everything through the lens of your own lived experience, because what you know limits what you can dream, right? And so until you put yourself out there and experience a lot of things, meet a lot of people, fail a whole ton.

It it’s not possible for you to think bigger. And so when I look at all of the most successful entrepreneurs, I admire. They are hand in hand with failure. They are linked together and they’re excited about it. And so I think if you can fail forward and fail fast, you are going to do so much for your business compared to just trying to, you know, navigate everything with as much perfection as possible.

Akua Konadu: Tip number 11 is from episode 30 with LinkedIn branding expert and business coach, Lucretia Davis. She sat down with us to talk about her excitement. Explosive six figure business strategies for LinkedIn. And she says business owners need to let go of their ego in order to succeed. 

Lakrisha: If I could just dish out a few things.

Number one would be ego. I have observed that ego stops a lot of people from succeeding in business. And when I say ego, not ego that we think about on a daily basis, like, Oh, this person got a big ego. They think they’re all that. It’s not that it is. Having the ability to have a, um, a healthy ego in business, which will help you sustain means to understand that it’s okay to listen to someone’s guidance, whether it’s your coach, consultant, or even know, have the humility enough to know that you do need help.

So that is. And when you get in those settings, actually being able to trust someone. Ego in terms of not getting so offended or frustrated that your content isn’t growing like overnight. And being like the heck with this, because I’m not, I don’t like not being good at stuff. That’s one of the biggest things that I deal with, with my audience, because they’re brilliant people and they are so used to getting things right.

And in a quick turnaround time, and it just does not happen like that in business. And so when they don’t get the quick result, then they’re just like, Oh, this isn’t for me or, Oh, you don’t know what you’re talking about. You don’t, you’re not teaching it right. Or, Oh, you know, it’s this and it’s everything else and everybody else, but, but me.

So I would say that is another thing that holds people back in ego in the sense that you don’t have that level of empathy. For your audience, where you’re continuously trying to find ways to improve the value of the service that you’re providing them to ask for feedback and not get offended. Take that feedback and think like a business person and be like, okay, I’m going to consider this.

Take notes on this to continuously improve my stuff. I would say ego is a real big one that separates people. I have humble confidence. Like you cop, you can do this. Like, you know, you know, your stuff, like. I’m good at this. I can, I can change the world. I can make an impact, but humble confidence in that.

Okay. But now I need help putting the frameworks in place and actually launch this and getting counsel on how to make this grow and work. That’s not my zone of genius. This is my zone of genius. And I’m comfortable with that. 

Akua Konadu: And tip number 12 is from episode 19 with financial expert and New York times bestselling author, Tori Dunlap.

We break down how she turned a single Tik TOK video into a hundred thousand email subscribers. Her hot take to business success, be controversial. 

Tori: It’s immediately gonna have an asterisk on it, but this is the easiest way I can say it. Be controversial. Like, have something to say. I don’t mean controversial and like, say racist stuff, that’s not what I mean.

I mean like, have an opinion. Especially in 2023. People expect you to have an opinion and people also expect to either connect with you and understand what your business is or, or not. I will use a TikTok trend to explain this. The girls that get it, get it. And the girls that don’t, don’t. Like they will either get what you’re doing or they won’t.

Trying to be everything to everybody makes you nothing to nobody. I’m going to say that again. Trying to be everything to everybody makes you nothing to nobody. That is the probably biggest thing that I see. A general, like anybody entrepreneur, uh, tried to do is they’re like, okay, I need, I need to get clients and I need to get money.

So I am just going to offer everything and I’m going to offer it to everybody. When I like went viral for the first time in 2019, I had a piece go out in market watch, which is like a, you know, financial publication, but it, it blew up. It got like a million views in, I think like a week. For like a news article, which was pretty substantial, especially for MarketWatch.

And um, the interesting thing was, is that 95 percent of the comments on that piece were vitriolic. They hated me. They did not like me. They were men in their 60s named Steve, who were like, I don’t get her. Why does she have to make this a gendered issue? Why can’t she just talk about money? And I had this really Interesting choice then, which is, Oh, am I doing something wrong?

Right? Am I doing, am I doing something wrong? Should I shift? I clearly, I don’t appeal to these people and I’m losing potential, you know, followers or clients, but then I realized actually I’m doing something right because if they don’t get it again, girls would get it, get it. The girls don’t don’t the people who understand what we do at her first hundred K become brand evangelists for us.

If you are turned off by the word feminism, you’re not going to follow me. And you never were going to follow me, you were never going to be somebody who wanted to be a part of this community, right? So, yes, if you follow Dave Ramsey, if, again, you don’t like the word feminist, you’re not going to like me.

Great, there’s plenty of other people out there. There’s also, literally, Tens, probably hundreds of millions of women, people who love what we do, who are very aligned in terms of our customer persona, who will 100 percent get it because we have opinions, because we are speaking our mind, because to some people we might be deemed slightly controversial, and I put that in quotes.

So, trying to be everything to everybody makes you nothing to nobody. I need you to pick the right person. The person, the thing you’re trying to say, and understand that not everybody’s going to get it, and that actually means you’re doing something right. Because the people that will, will tattoo your brand on their forehead.

Like, they will love it and come back and be so excited to engage with you. And that’s the people that you want, just from a business angle. Those are the people that purchase from you and keep purchasing from you. Those are the people who like everything you post, right? The people who are fair weather, You know, followers or people who are like, yeah, I don’t really get it.

You don’t want those people anyway. So, especially when you’re first getting started. And I think anybody at any stage of the business, really important to remind yourself, have the people in mind. Don’t try to be everything to everybody. Understand. You have to connect with the people you’re trying to connect with and they should immediately understand if this is for them or not.

If it’s not cool, they move on. If it’s for them, that’s, that’s the time to start nurturing. 

Akua Konadu: That wraps up our episode roundup. Thank you so much for tuning in and celebrating with us. I hope that these conversations serve as a reminder that you are powerful and the work that you do matters. The work of independent business owners matter.

And we at HoneyBook, we are so grateful to show up with you. every single week to help you create the life and business you deserve. If you have enjoyed today’s episode, help us spread the word by sharing a screenshot of your favorite episode to your Instagram stories. This helps us reach more people and supports the show.

Thank you so much for being here. And until next time, that ends our episode of the independent business podcast. Everything we’ve discussed today can be found at podcast. honeybook. com. Head to our website to access for show notes, relevant links, and all of the resources that you need to level up. And if you’ve enjoyed today’s episode, be sure to subscribe to the podcast to make sure you never miss our future content, drop us a review and leave our guests some love on social.

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